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P11d HELP!

Here is the situation...

..I took over some business accounts for a client and have been given the breakdown of his director's account which has been divided into sections relevant to the P11d which are clothing, cosmetics, audio and theatre/cinema.  The client has a habit of paying for business expenses out of his own money and so these get credited to the director's account however there are transaction that have been entered to the director's account that are also showing on the P11d an example.

DR Balance of £20,655.97

CR of £127.70 for cosmetics - this has been put to the P11d section.  However, I know for a fact that this was paid for by the client himself and not the business so therefore it should have never been entered into the director's account and should not be on his P11d - right??

I am sure that I am correct but seeing as this is a reputable accountants firm that have dealt with this previously I am doubting myself.

This is not just the only one there are quite a few, in fact every transaction entered onto the P11d has been paid for by the client personally and not by the business.

Any help will be greatly appreciated seeing as I only have until Friday to get this sorted!

P.s he hasn't received any payment from the business for these items.  


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04th Jul 2012 09:17

Question...and possibly the answer

I am definitely not a P11D expert so this is as much a question as - hopefully - a useful comment.

Isn't the point that the Company intends to pay (/reimburse the director) for these expenses rather than whether they have already paid for them?


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04th Jul 2012 10:35

In this case no because it is a private expense that was paid for privately by the director.

I see it as eg


I buy a jumper for £10 and pay for this myself.  This is not a business expense but I send my accountant the receipts.  They then key this to Clothing/Directors Account and then this gets put on the P11d.  In my opinion this is wrong - no?

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04th Jul 2012 13:09

If the purchases are private expenses, paid for by the director privately using his own personal cash or credit / debit card, then no record of these should appear on the company's books, and certainly not in the director's account or on the P11D.  P11D items include those private expenses which the company has paid for on behalf of the director - but certainly not private transactions with which the company has had no involvement. 

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04th Jul 2012 21:45

It is clear we all agree

on the principle, but the question remains - does the company intend to pay for these expenses?  If it does, then the former accountants are correct that they are a P11D items.  If the company does not intend to pay then they should not appear on the P11D.

It is possible the client instructed the former accountants to put the expenses "through the company's books" or just sent all receipts to the accountants and left the matter to their discretion (and they took this to mean the client wished them to be reimbursed by the company).

Your client is the person to ask as he is the director. 


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04th Jul 2012 22:08


Private expenses should not go on the company books if they were paid personally.

What is the advantage of getting the company to pay for them?

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05th Jul 2012 00:26

I suspect that they might not actually be personal expenses

Is the client in the entertaining industry? I'm guessing an actor, perhaps?

If so, perhaps he's paying expenses personally, that the company can claim as a CT deduction. To get them in the company's books, they need to be credited to his DCA.

Because the company's reimbursing expenses for items used by the director in the course of his employment, they go on his P11D (absent a dispensation - shut up Peter!). He then makes a S.336 claim via his personal Tax Return and the Class 1A NIC calculation gets a similar adjustment.

No Class 1A NIC, no personal tax bill, but a CT deduction in the company.

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05th Jul 2012 13:59

Thanks for your input everyone!

I think I know what I am doing now!

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