Filing by Internet

Filing by Internet

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We have just filed the majority of our tax returns using FBI and it has made the rush at the end of January so much easier. Talking to other accountants, I do get the impression that the level of uptake is not very high and wonder why this should be the case. Is it because of problems people have encountered?

What about FBI 2 (PAYE)? We are just about to register our clients for this as well.

Many thanks in advance.
Susan Lawes

Replies (14)

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By andyprentice
11th Feb 2004 11:21

paperless office
What we do is give the hard copy printouts of the returns to the clients to keep. They pass to us an authorisation form which we keep on file. In the past we had kept photocopies of every return submitted, which meant the files became huge very quickly. Now we have the data on computer (and back up!), printed summaries and the client has the signed original return. We use Drummohr and it seems to work very well. The built in validation routine prevents submitting a return by FBI which would fail e.g. too many entries on the CGT pages etc.

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By Briar
10th Feb 2004 17:14

But how does one keep a paperless office ?
I have not used the FBI or ELS systems because I understand that I am expected to keep a signed version of the Return in my files. As I am trying (!) to maintain a paperless office, I refuse to keep loads of paper just to satisfy the Revenue. Instead, I keep the returns on disk (with 3 back ups) and give the Revenue all the paper. If they would change the system so that I just had to keep one sheet of paper with the relevant box numbers and contents on it and have it signed by the client, I might do so. After all, in many cases, there are relatively few boxes actually completed but the Revenue still insist of having the whole Return (10 pages plus supplements.

As a result, I print off the returns, get the client to sign them and then deliver all of them to my nearest tax office (I love to see the look on the reception desk staff when I ask for a receipt for them all !!)

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By zxcvb
10th Feb 2004 09:33

When is a partnership not a partnership?
This was our first year of using FBI (Drummhor) and have used it for more than 80% of our returns. We quickly made sure that 64-8s were in place for all partnerships in December, but encountered a problem in late January. Several partnerships, although included on our client list downloaded from the IR portal, had been classified by IR staff as individuals so would not accept a partnership return.

Some last minute running around to collect paper returns was involved, but once I found someone at the FBU helpdesk who understood what the problem was, they were very helpful. I even received a call from IR at 8pm on 30th Jan to say they would work on it through the night and we would be able to submit in the morning!

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By frauke
09th Feb 2004 17:30

Internet Filing
I tried it for the first time this year, and found it very good, fast and efficent.

The only complaint I have is over the statements which aren't always up to date.

I intend to do all the 2003/04 returns using this method, and am going to try and get as many in before the July statements go out, so any reductions can be applied straight away. This should save me time & effort, and be far more cost effective. Maybe I'll have January off!

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By AnonymousUser
10th Feb 2004 10:08

ELS/FBI
I have used ELS for years via CCH Taxpoint, and have also tried to use FBI as well. However I too have found that although returns pass the Taxpoint validation checks, they cannot all be used for FBI especially if there are large CGT details, foreign pages, non-resident pages etc. In these cases ELS works every time. The speedy release of tax refunds is SOLELY due to using electronic filing of some sort, and absolutely NOTHING to do with the tax office involved. I have managed to achieve instant refunds for all cases filed electronically by whatever system. Sadly this year, when the Revenue changed their website, my password was lost, and I have tried on FOUR separate occasions to obtain a replacement, being assured in each case that the new one had been sent out. I gave up on this unequal stuggle at the end of December and successfully filed the remainder using ELS. I am now about to try and get another password!!!

Despite all this, my message is ELECTRONIC FILING WORKS - USE IT!

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By Philip Hoyle
04th Feb 2004 10:35

It's getting better!
2002/3 was the fourth year we tried using ELS/FBI and it "was good for us!" too, especially when the IR starting sending acknowledgement emails actually saying which taxpayer they were talking about (Late 2003 onwards). We e-filed probably over half our SA returns.

The earlier three years were just a shambles - it took months to get a working ID code and password, the IR websites were often down and the help-lines were next to useless.

I think the IR launched it far too soon, without the proper training and technology in place. A lot of agents tried to use it and because it was unworkable, have given up. They will now need more persuading to try again.

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By John Savage
04th Feb 2004 12:35

Not Bad!!
I have to say as well that the FBI system seemed to work very well this year for me as well.

Most of the returns were accepted easily, and I agree with the comments below about the reference number being on the e-mails. As a result I have proof that any particular return has been filed by the due date.

My only complaint was that with returns which had several CGT details on them, for instance, sales of shares, my tax software (Digita Taxability Pro) was showing the return as being fine to file by FBI, but Revenue then rejected them. I believe this was more due to Revenue's computer, as the message it spat out was meaningless to anyone but a programmer!

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By andyprentice
04th Feb 2004 12:46

partnership worked well
We managed to file some partnership returns after it became live in December. This was an improvement firstly to submit all the returns by one method simultaneously and to know it had been received by IR. In the past with snail mail the IR didnt acknowledge receipt of partnership returns and it was a pain trying to prove they had been sent.

I understand that CGT is limited on internet filing - hopefully it will be adapted to allow more transactions than it does at present.

Overall it is an improving service and great for clients with tax refunds due - some get sorted in a week.

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By John Savage
04th Feb 2004 14:30

Tax Rebates
I filed my own personal return on Saturday 24th January (yes I know I was working on a Saturday, probably not the only accountant either!!) and my tax rebate was in my bank by the following Thursday.

Not bad eh?? (and normally you won't find much praise for the Revenue from myself)

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By Abacjm
04th Feb 2004 17:55

ELS is Best For Me.
I have used ELS (Drummohr Technology) since the inception of electronic filing and it now runs very smoothly. In 96/97, there were problems at the Revenue end - and there may still be some there - due to using older computers, but Drummohr hava a built in validation that checks the Return is suitable for filing and both last year and this year, all my returns have sailed through.
Like Mr Savage, some of my clients are already reporting having received their rebates, which must be a record, but I suspect that that may be down to the tax office concerned.
I tried to register for FBI when it first came on stream, but gave up. It would have been easier to get into Fort Knox! Maybe they have improved it now AND trained the staff to answer questions without fobbing off, but here is one who is more than happy to pay Drummohr their annual licence fee for the peace of mind of knowing the software works.
They are also one of the first to be approved each year by the I/R for S/T's, Partnerships, Trusts and Ministers of Religion. Company Returns and P11D software are also available at additional cost. FBI is included in the cost of the ELS licence, so if anyone does want to change, the same records will still do without any re-keying.

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By martin.truroglass
04th Feb 2004 21:56

PAYE P11D's
Last year I filed the P11d's via the IR own On-line forms. Although accepted by the computer they never to my knowledge made our IR office and I filed paper ones on 5th July (the last day).

I intend to use the On Line system for all returns this year (!) so fingers crossed.

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By AnonymousUser
05th Feb 2004 13:13

fbi
google and put in -

'america's most wanted'.

you will find everything there.

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By mxhoward
05th Feb 2004 18:14

Given up
I struggled with electronic filing for a couple of years (maybe 75% success) then lost the password. The process of getting a new password was too cumbersome and when coupled with the high failure rate I decided not to bother any more.

I get my returns done fairly quickly and sent to the revenue on paper by August/September. Rebates all came back in a few weeks this time.

Mike

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By excalibur
06th Feb 2004 14:03

Speedy refunds
The refunds for those whose returns were filed on or after 29th January are coming through thick and fast now, creating some very happy clients!

I did find the registration process for FBI quite awkward, back in late 2002 - is this better now?

We have also had the same problem John Savage encountered, with unintelligible error messages when trying to file a couple of returns which had already cleared Digita's internal FBI submission checks. Digita's helpline was first class (and well-manned for the last week of January) and it was found to be a limit in the number of characters which could be entered in some of the boxes. I would imagine Digita will build this additional check into the product shortly.

We do still have some problems with the electronic regime:
The 'agent maintainers' at some tax offices do not appear to be pressing the right buttons when processing 64-8s, so that we cannot see Statements online or submit SARs by FBI.
Some clients which have been 'flagged' for FBI do not have names showing on the system, only UTRs!
The statements we can see online are often six months out-of-date, so fairly useless when checking payments on account.

Does anyone at the Revenue have any comments please? Let's see what we can do to help you to increase the number of returns filed online next year!

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