Practising Certificate

Practising Certificate

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I am going round in circles in trying to get a practising certificate and wondered if anyone could come up with some advice.

I am AAT and ACCA qualified. I have only worked in industry.

It seems to me that I need to work in practice for three years - I have got agencies to phone around practices saying that I would be willing to work for £10 an hour for the first year just to try and get into a practice, but none have been interested (I'm in my 40's maybe that doesn't help).

I could register my employer as ACCA accredited, but as I am the most senior qualified employee I have no one to sign my forms off.

I have called local accountants (Oxfordshire) to sub-contract but they are not interested as I haven't worked in practice.

There must be some way I can get a certificate - I'm not trying to get it an 'easy' way - I'm happy to do the three years work, study - anything, but I just can't find any other options.

If anyone has any advice I would be most grateful.

Replies (17)

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By Moonbeam
27th Mar 2010 12:31

Getting work in the profession

Your job is to become a salesperson for yourself, which is not something most accountants specialise in. You are going to have to be persistent and hardworking in this endeavour.

Agencies are not the answer. You are the star person to market yourself.

You should go to as many local ACCA events as you can find, and look out lots of business networking events in your area and go to those. Your aim will be to get to know local accountants running medium sized practices. If you explain how you can help them make money and how reasonable you would expect your pay to be in a positive and friendly way, even if those you meet have no openings, they may well know someone else who does.

At the same time, go through the members' handbooks looking for practices in your area that are likely to be able to take you on in the future. Look up their websites and think about how to engage with them by letter, talking in terms of their interests rather than yours. You should then write a letter to a named person who appears from your research to be in charge of recruitment explaining what you can offer them and enclosing your cv. In your letter refer to the research you have done on their firm to make it clear that you are serious and care about them.

Reword your cv to make your past experience relevant to the accountancy profession rather than a commercial employer. This is your ticket to an interview.

You need to visit your local large library often and ask the librarians for help in accessing more data for your target audience.

Keep records of who you've written to, and the date. Make sure you only write to those who you think could accommodate you. You will waste time if you don't properly target your market.

Follow up your first letter a week after you write it by asking to speak to the person you wrote to. Plan beforehand what you are going to say, so they don't feel too pressurised if they really don't have any openings right now. Leave them with a good impression. When a member of staff slips on a banana skin the following day and is off sick for 3 months they may think of you very favourably.

Write to them again in 3 months, and every 3 months after that if the phone call went well.

Read up about how to sell yourself and your background. There are plenty of books out there on the subject. Your local Chamber of Commerce may well run free or low price courses on selling and this is what you need to get to grips with.

Think of the friends and acquaintances you have. Maybe their friends and relatives can help you. Ask them in a non pushy way if they can think of anyone they know running an accountancy practice that they could introduce you to.

By treating yourself as a small business and spending lots of time researching the best people to contact and how to find them you will find the right opening. It will take time and energy, but will be excellent experience for you if you want to set up on your own in the future.

Good luck. Fortune favours the brave!

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By User deleted
28th Mar 2010 14:07

Why bother?

Why do you need a certificate? Surely you can practise without a certificate as long as you don't claim to be a member of one of the institutes? Advertising your membership is not going to bring in many new clients as such, so why not  practise as an unqualified accountant?  Many people do that, and earn a lot more than £10 an hour. I know one who refuses to  get out of bed for less than £200 an hour!

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By User deleted
29th Mar 2010 12:04

Catch 22

AFAIR an ACCA member practicing without a PC would be in breach even if they made no reference to their qualifications.

This leaves the OP in the invidious position of having to resign a hard earned professional membership in order to practice or get the relevant experience required.

It strikes me this is overly harsh.  If the ACCA had confidence in (i) their training standards and (ii) the ethical stance of members in taking on work which they felt competant to do then it would be a simpler and fairer system.

 

Lisa

(holder of ACCA PC but disgrundled with ACCAs corporate attitude generally)

 

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By User deleted
29th Mar 2010 17:13

Try IFA

The Institute of Financial Accountants may admit ACCA qualified accountants without the need for further examination. Their requirements for the issue of a practising certificate are more flexible than those of ACCA.

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By User deleted
30th Mar 2010 13:57

You have some experience...

I have the same qualifications and made the same move in my early 40's.

Focus on getting the ACCA PC as the ATT seemed to me to be far more flexible/helpful.

List all the areas of expertise you have covered in your past 2.5 years in your present job. In my case this was Payroll, P11d's, Accounts Prep., Corp Tax, Vat returns etc. Get the MD to sign this off.

Also milk the ATT study/qualification as evidence of your enthusiasm for CPD.

Then you only need to persuade a Sole Practitioner to let you do some unpaid work preparing tax returns for 6 months. Get the SP to sign off the 6 months submission detailing this.

Submit the whole lot to the ACCA. They then told me I had to get the SP ACCA Accredited. I told them to get stuffed. They said OK then and gave me the PC.

Simples.

 

 

 

 

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By User deleted
30th Mar 2010 17:17

Accreditation

I hadn't realised that there was any room for negotiation as far as the accreditation goes, or with any part of the application. Thanks I may try that route.

It seems to me that there are not many small accountancy firms that have accreditation.

I asked the ACCA for information regarding companies with accreditation in my area and they told me that they don't give that information out! They don't exactly promote it do they.

 

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By User deleted
30th Mar 2010 19:22

Accreditation

Yes, last Anon here again.

The whole ACCA Accreditation scheme is designed for large firms.

Typical ACCA in that they try the old blanket approach.

I'm afraid that I misread your original post and thought that you were ATT rather than AAT but just ignore that bit of my reply.

Actually, to fill you in, once I had decided to move from Industry to Practice I opted to do the ATT exams just as a tax refresher. They are pretty tough - I passed 2nd attempt so maybe not a wise move unless you have the time available to devote to it. But I would say that the ATT is a far more focussed organisation and I think that eventually I will jetison the ACCA.

As I said you can negotiate/bully ACCA Prof Standards. Make a list of all the skills you have. Then phone them and ask what more they would expect you to have.

Challenge their letters. Phone up and ask to speak to next numpty up the chain.

I worked for 4 firms (some part-time) on my path to becoming a Sole Practitioner. One ACCA, one CIMA, Two Chartered. The competence of a couple of the senior (Practice Certificate Holding) people was eye-wateringly bad so its not as if ACCA Prof Standards are protecting the public by refusing to grant you a PC.

Good luck with it.

 

 

 

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By Chrispoman
06th Apr 2010 13:24

Good old HMRC

I was in a similar position last year. My first move was to contact HMRC, who, after a little form filling and a cheque for £120 (I think!) they awarded me a Practicing Certificate. At the time I was not in any association, but now I am AIAB. Even so, I still use my HMRC PC. It cannot be issued by a higher authority.

Since my start on 1 May 2009, my practice has rapidly grown to having 14 clients and two people I outsource work to when I am too busy.

Good luck with it all.

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By User deleted
06th Apr 2010 15:31

Chrispoman

Are you being serious?

HMRC do not issue practising certificates!!

What they do is confirm you are registered for anti money laundering purposes but there is absolutely no element of practising certificate in it, no test of competence, qualifications or experience.

Sorry but your post stunned me!

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By User deleted
06th Apr 2010 15:53

Also...

... what's AIAB please?

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By Chrispoman
06th Apr 2010 18:37

OK

Yes. It is neccessary to have that. It has allowed me to offer outsourced accountancy and payroll services to businesses large and small. However, as a member of the Sage Professional Bookkeepers Club and also the IAB, that probably helps. A "Practicing Certificate" is no more than a piece of paper confirming your qualifications, which you already have. Why not, if asked, just produce a copy of the original diploma?

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By Chrispoman
06th Apr 2010 18:40

AIAB

Associate of the International Association of Bookkeepers

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By User deleted
06th Apr 2010 20:09

Still stunned

 "A "Practicing Certificate" is no more than a piece of paper confirming your qualifications, which you already have"

No it's not.  I'm sorry to be rude but I am still stunned, you really don't get it do you?

To get a practising certificate from one of the Chartered bodies, i.e. ICAEW you have to prove post qualification experience and CPD in addition to the original qualification.   You then need to comply with regulations such as PII and ongoing monitoring.

It is not just a statement of your qualification.    In fact if just a 'standard' Chartered Accountant were to practise in their own name, without getting a practising certificate and meeting the conditions of it, the ICAEW would discipline them and possibly kick them out of membership.

 

 

 

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By Chrispoman
06th Apr 2010 20:23

Certificate

When an expert book keeper has been in business for 20 years, having been brought up on double entry, then single entry (Kalamazoo), then computerised systems, don't you think that's enough experience to "Go it alone"?

For someone who is qualified as FCCA, there would be no doubt in client's minds that the experience is there.

If the person is thus qualified, apart from MLR regulations, what other paperwork would they need? 

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By hsr1012
12th Apr 2010 17:16

Become an AAT MIP

Go to the AAT and sign up as a Member in Practice they will then issue you with a practicing certificate.

Hope this helps.

Helen

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By SamDenby
20th Apr 2010 13:49

AAT PC

AAT is a great way to get in but be warned that you may be required to have an ACCA PC after the three years. I qualified as ACA already having obtained AAT, but I had to have 2 years post qual experience. So I registered as MIP, then each year I completed my ACA membership details, stating my position with AAT PC, no questions were asked.  Then last year, I had a 'review' from ACA, and they told me I was in breach of a bye law, practising under the AAT PC and needed dual PC. I had to explain the situation and reiterated with them that I had provided the information openly on my membership form and it was never questioned. The up shot of it all, I was fined and a note has been put on my record should any inquire about my status with the institute. And I now have to pay for two PC's, I also had to change my PI because the ACA didn't have my insurance company on their 'recognised' list. I wish you every sucess good luck.

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By Johnday72
06th Sep 2010 09:18

Posted by Anonymous on Tue, 30/03/2010 - 17:17

May I ask if your approach to the ACCA was successful on this basis?

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