Hi
I finally made my laptop decision and went for the MacBook Pro. I now need to sort out the Windows side of it.
Do I just buy Windows 8 (and update to the Pro version for £25 before end Jan), or do I need to buy a special version of Windows for the Mac? I need to be able to use my MS Office software including Visio, Project etc and also VT+, Moneysoft, TaxCalc, Sage, Quickbooks and so on.
I don't want to mess it up so wondered if anyone could just steer me in the right direction. I was hoping to make use of the Microsoft discounts for students when buying this software, but want the pro versions.
thanks for any help/advice.
Eve
Replies (30)
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Bootcamp
Hi Eve,
I run windows 7 on a Macbook Air. You just need a standard copy.
Install it using Bootcamp - there's loads of instructional videos etc on the web
Mac Pro Advice
Go back to the Apple shop (even if you bought on line) and thhey will give you all options and costs. I have never experienced better support than Apple everyone one of them seem to know their stuff and cannot do enough to help.
VirtualBox
Virtual Box - not smooth to run
VirtualBox works perfectly for me - simple copy and paste between Mac & Windows, shared drives, 'seamless mode' so Windows apps just appear to run on the Mac desktop. I do all my software development work on it and run 10 different versions of Sage 50, Instant & 200 on it with no problems.
You mentioned Sage in your first post - if you go for Windows 8, bear in mind that Sage only support v2012 of v2013, I've already found issues with earlier versions.
John
Office for Mac
I am wondering why you would need to use Windows at all on your Mac? I partitioned my drive once using parallels I think and I suppose it was OK, but frankly, every time I moved from using the brilliant Mac OS to whatever heap of crap MS have out, it was a soul crushing experience. Like buying a new pair of shoes only to discover a dog [***] inside!
For MS Office, windows, Excel, Powerpoint, Office for Mac is actually terrific and is made for Mac. In fact, Excel was initialed developed by Bill Gates for the Mac only. I have kids in school, and so got a copy from a recommended reseller on the MS website, Software4students I think. I think I paid £37 for it. Yes, £37 for the whole software, compared to at least £200 if I had the Windows version. I think the price might be about £100 now, and this allows an installation on 2 macs, but still a steal.
http://www.software4students.co.uk/products/microsoft-office-for-mac-2011
For presentations, I have actually been using Keynote a lot on the iPad and it is also available on the Mac. The iPad version is really good now and provides cloud storage, meaning I can start it on one device and carry on on another. Connects up to pretty much any projector.
I am sure there are accounting and bookeeping packages for the Mac. I really would give yourself a break and think of all the weeks of the your life you can get back using software that just works. I shudder at the years, it must be years, I have wasted using MS's offerings.
Just my opinion!
Office for Mac
Just be aware that the Mac version of Excel (don't know about the other programs) is not as fully featured as the Windows version.
Software4Students mentioned above currently has Office Professional Plus for £150 which is good value (this includes many extra programs over the basic versions especially Access). However they have quite strict eligibility conditions (e.g. the licensee has to be a student or faculty member) and a lot of their software is for non commercial use so worth checking before you buy.
Restrictions
Not aware of any restrictions on Mac software (eg Pages), so even more reason to avoid MS.
As far as I was aware, the licencee could be me, so long as the software would be used by a student, which it is.
Well it doesn't support
PowerPivots for a start which for me is a deal breaker.
Re licence: This was not my understanding of the conditions and I know I have always hit snags when I have looked at them in the past. TBH I have't spent that much time looking at it but I still think it's worth checking the conditions before buying.
I use Windows XP through Parallels on an iMac, and also a MacBook. This enables me to run the Windows and Mac environments side by side, and using the Parallels Coherance mode, almost seamlessly. The reason I need Windows software is so that I may use VT Transaction+ as bookkeeping software, together with TaxCalc. I have Microsoft Office installed on both the Windows and Mac sides (but only because I got MS Office 2007 free as part of the MS Professional Accountants network when the launched the now defunct MS Office Accounting)
If you were to install Windows directly via BootCamp, I believe you would have to make a choice each time you logged on as to whether you were starting as a PC or a Mac, hence mychoice of using Parallels.
I am using quite old versions, and am considering upgrading to later versions (in case everything stops working - but no problems so far).
Windows on MacBook Pro
Parallels & Windows XP are far and away the most straightforward and best options.
Seamless transfer between he two OS.
Windows XP still rock solid for so many core programmes especially if you are not a tecchie-early-adopter and must have the latest of everything now and instantly.
Not a luddite but XP and Sage 2009, MSOffice 2003 just run all client requirements and I do have a life.
Why create problems where none exist.
For all the media stuff, pics, video, etc the Mac is lovely and if you want to save money buy a refurbished one with as much RAM as possible.
The decision isn't just the hardware
Sorry to state the "bleeding obvious", but when moving from PC to Mac the decision is actually more a case of looking at the software than it is the hardware.
As it happens all the above solutions seem to cover the advise I got when thinking about moving but, on the Office front, as a stop gap I downloaded the free Open Office which matches the main Office products and, 18 months later, I'm still using it.
As with hosting and online accounting eventually most software will be used in that way making your choice of hardware a lot easier.
In case you've not done it, it's definitely worth viewing the Mac Basic videos and screens, especially the PC to Mac section. Wish I'd made the switch years ago, my Mac Air is brilliant, will never buy another pc/laptop.
Parallels
I can recommend Parellels and ther is no problem with 'messing it up' as all of the drivers etc are present within the install process to make it as easy as things can be on OSX.
I also used it as a means to log on to clients networks when needed - their IT dept is often more comfortable with Windows configurations and this makes it easy to do so. The Mac can then access the network drives.
Good luck!
Student software - if not a student ...
@eve2206
'.. I know someone at university so should be able to get cheap software ..'
@The VAT Doctor
'.. I have kids in school, and so got a copy from a recommended reseller on the MS website, Software4students ..'
Would suggest that everyone reads the relevant T&C's
Essentially if you personally are not eligible (by being a student) then why is it deemed acceptable to purchase & use a product only available for student use?
Sorry to be a kill-joy and state the obvious but this is fraud - so not quite sure why everyone thinks this is OK and no-one has commented about this on a site aimed at the Profession
Any professional who engages in this and uses fraudulent software as part of their buisness is just as culpable as any other fraudster - softaware theft, plain stealing money or benefit fraud - what is the difference?
... and how would your professional body view this action? In fact has anyone put it to ICAEW etc. and obtained a definative ruling together with information on what action they would take if someone was reported to them
You may not like M$ & their charges but is that a valid reason for this approach
Agreed this is a minefield …
@eve2206
Just so that I understand the situation
A new Mac has been purchased for the business and the original question stated ‘.. I need to be able to use my MS Office software including Visio, Project etc ..’You already have Office 2007 but wish to acquire 2010/11 to install on the Mac, rather than the existing legal copy you already ownThe Mac is a business computer and yet assurances are provided that when Office 2010/11 is installed on it, no business use will ever take place on this version of OfficeThe actual M$ wording below says ‘.. business ..’
With all the above facts in mind it might be stretching a point to claim that the software will never be used for business purposes
One set of wording actually says - ‘.. The software is not licensed for any commercial business activities, nonprofit business activities, or revenue-generating business activities ..’
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/937676
All M$ software is accompanied by an EULA (end user license agreement) for the specific product and it may differ between versions of the same product (2007/2010).
Whilst families of students are eligible to use the product, alumni are not – so one would imagine that once the family member has completed education the product becomes invalid.
This is backed up the T&C’s associated with M$ Action Pack products, where, if you cease with your subscription the all applicable M$ software must be removed from your machines - in the past on Aweb there have been members of the profession wanting to take this route as a 'free ride', which clearly it is not
https://mspartner.microsoft.com/en/uk/pages/membership/action-pack-dev-d...
Anyway having 2007 really does not exhonorate one from buying 2010/2011 which unfortunately should be purchased via the upgrade route
These EULA’s introduce a grey area and may not be easy to enforce; nevertheless, would anyone really want to be on the receiving end of a legal action by M$. Also don’t forget that later versions of Office have different file formats and one wouldn’t be surprised if the resulting file could be indentified by the version that created it in the first place
Finally, in today’s environment a computer with appropriate software is probably a ‘given’ in rather the same way as a desk & chair; and in theory ones charge out rates should accommodate all the overheads in running the business.
Of course no-one likes to pay for software, especially at some of M$ rates. however, it is a cost of doing business and confusing as to why certain areas are deemed worthwhile (i.e. Mac @ 3 times a pc cost) whereas the software to assist in running the business is begrudged.
Parallels again
I use Parallels, I did initially find it really slowed down my Mac though. After a while I upgraded the memory to 8gb and stopped pretty much everything I could from being in Windows startup and everything started working really well.
So if you are going for the Parallels option I would suggest you try and keep Windows pretty clean.
As someone said above the Mac version of Office is just not as good as the Windows one, though Google Docs is pretty great IMO.
Why not
If your Dell is knackered and just there as an emergency backup and assuming the licence for the copy of Office on your Dell allows it, why not take Office off the Dell and put it on the Mac under Parallels and put the free Open Office onto the Dell for the odd time you need to use it?
Current Setup
Hi,
I am in the same situation, my current setup is a MacBook Air running VM Ware to install Windows 7. I run VT accounts, TaxCalc and BrightPay. This all works extremely well and being about to flip between Mac and Windows is just the best. VM Ware piggy backs on the hardware of the Mac, so you can use all the features. Only one thing to point out, is the VM Ware virtual machine is about 40gb, so make sure you get a big enough hard drive.
Best thing I ever did.
Good luck
Ashton Accountancy
How to live in a Mac and MS world
This wont help those wanting to run MS versions of SAGE etc on the mac but is an alternative to loading office on the mac.
Look up Office 365 just launched - Basically you use software on an MS server somewhere so no need to have anything loaded locally.
Won't suit all I guess.
The studient software is licensed to those in education , when that ends they need to buy a different license. I am not allowed to run my business on my childrens software and there are more and more ways of being caught out these days. My business is more valauable than the few hundred quid I have to pay MS and the like so for me its not worth the risk of waking up one day and I cannot access anything.
Running Sage Line 50 on a Mac / iPad
The easiest way to run Sage on a Mac / iPad is to use Online50's Sage cloud system.
http://www.online50.net/sfx/Newsletter.html?Issue=September 2010#NA-452
Call them to talk.
For more information on using Apple Macs or other non-Windows platforms with the Online50 service call us on 0871 384 3511 (Service Delivery team) or 0800 195 0835 (Pre-sales team
Mac v PC
Why buy a Mac when you just want to turn it into a PC?
Equivalent priced PCs are far more powerful than their Mac counterparts and are much easier to upgrade.
About the only advantage is that the Mac OS, being a Unix derivative, does not have the same sort of virus problems that plague Windows. Many also claim that it is superior and easier to use.
- But it appears that you are intending to run a virtualised version of Windows 8, negating this.
Personally I would stick with native Mac software. LibreOffice (an offshoot of OpenOffice) can be used if you need to be compatible with MS Office.
You can use Fink or MacPorts to run most opensource software natively.
Beauty of the Mac is not Windows
Hi, the beauty of running a Mac is being able to avoid Windows! I'm really not sure why you would want to try and change a beautiful Mac into a lovely machine dedicated to running Windows...
Having said that it is very easy to do, and there's no need to be afraid of the machine ... being a Mac it just works straight out of the box, and it is actually very difficult to screw the thing up ... personally I wouldn't use BootCamp, since this means either booting into Windows or booting into MacOS each time you fire up ... far simpler to use Parallels or VMWare Fusion .... loading either of those is extremely simple as you just follow the onscreen instructions (which aren't many) and they both run Windows and MacOS side by side ... it's up to you which version of Windows you buy.
But I still don't understand totally why you'd want to buy a Mac purely for Windows .... yes, the machines are well made, last a long time, and do what they are supposed to do, but there is masses of dedicated Mac software, loads of online software which is independent of operating platform, and VMWare Fusion and/or Parallels for the odd occasion when you just must have a Windows programme. If you have bought the new MacBook pro with with the fantastic Retina display screen, then you've just made me very very very green with envy. Ahhhhhhhh.......
Best of both worlds
Hi there Eve,
Just adding my ten pennyworth in case you are still deciding! Running payroll software and working remotely for clients who bank with LloydsTSB meant that VMWare fusion was a necessity when I replaced my past-it Sony Viao with a 27" iMac. The only problem I very occasionally have is when my printer 'forgets' that it is meant to print from both Mac and Windows applications - yes, it's the Windows bit that stops functioning! Turning everything on and off again usually does the trick.
Some clients are now using cloud servers and logmein, both of which are equally happy with Mac and Windows. A couple still have VPNs which rely on Windows, but they'll learn!
As a previous poster said, the Apple support is very good - the techies there are very well trained and want everyone to love their Mac as much as they do :)
Incidentally, I had a query recently with the VMWare Fusion update and e-mailed the US support people. Imagine my surprise when I got a call from California to help me! I hadn't paid any extra for that, so it was pure goodwill on their part - I was just hoping for an e-mail back. 5* to them.
Good luck, and in your down time, enjoy the Mac side!
Best wishes
Alison
Alternative to Parallels/VMware
At present my only requirements for Windows are TaxCalc, Payroll Manager and VT. (I hope the first two become web based soon and would be great if VT started working with Google Spreadsheets but probably unlikely.)
For when the next licenses come up I'm planning to install them on a cheap (£35!) Dell desktop I bought off eBay which I keep running as a server at home. I can then use Remote Desktop to log in to it from anywhere with my Macbook.
I was worried it might be a bit sluggish but with good internet connections both sides it seems to be almost as good as using it directly.