Not personal experience but - here is a comment about a problem that someone encountered
‘.. I'm still recovering from a hardware failure at our cloud host's datacenter one week ago that took the disk drive with it. There was a backup of our website folder tree but not...wait for it...of the drive. Naturally, when I was told there was a backup that was being restored to the drive I assumed the drive was being restored from the backup.
I became suspicious that something was amiss when the sysadmin asked me twice how the web server settings would get restored, and looked puzzled when I replied they were on the drive, hence on the backup, and therefore when the restore was complete we need only restart the web server and voila! Well, the truth came out when the restore (such as it was) completed and I checked for key services used by the web application and found they were missing.
The takeaway: make no assumptions about backups whether hosting is in-house or managed. Ask specific questions and get specific answers ..’
Nevertheless it does bring to mind if you are a Cloud user – have you asked or do you know what you are getting?
Replies (7)
Please login or register to join the discussion.
Source of story?
"comment about a problem that someone encountered" sounds very much like an invented story to me. Got a source for this vague tale of woe or any other evidence that such a thing is actually a serious problem? Because my experience tells me that such services tend to have redundant backups to avoid the risk of data loss. For that matter, the description of the backup saving the content but not "the drive" doesn't make a great deal of sense in general terms anyway. You generally either have a backup, or you don't.
That's even before noting that the story is talking about a website (so not a cloud backup anyway)
Ever the sceptic ...
Was on a developers website but in reality why would one want to make it up?
If you don’t believe it, thats fine – go login & argue it out on the site concerned – you will certainly get short shrift over your limited knowledge in the field
Here is the site - http://www.codeproject.com/Lounge.aspx?msg=5060832#xx5060832xx
Over to you, and read the subsequent comments - none in the development community who responded took your stance
EDIT
When was the last time you implemented a Cloud/SaaS system?
Simple enough request
I'm sorry that my simple request for a source for a vague anecdote upset you so much. Since it was the basis for your argument it didn't seem unreasonable to ask for it to be verified. Was on a developers website but in reality why would one want to make it up?If you don’t believe it, thats fine – go login & argue it out on the site concerned – you will certainly get short shrift over your limited knowledge in the field
Here is the site - http://www.codeproject.com/Lounge.aspx?msg=5060832#xx5060832xx
Over to you, and read the subsequent comments - none in the development community who responded took your stance
EDIT
When was the last time you implemented a Cloud/SaaS system?
Which it still isn't by the way. Yes, that may well be a technical forum (never heard of it, but I'm guessing most non-accountants won't have heard of AccountingWeb either, so it might be really well-known to web developers) but it is still one random person telling an unsubstantiated tale. As you say, I could sign up there and tell a similar tale myself. I have family and friends in the business (I must ask them if they've heard of this site) so I have more knowledge of the field than you might expect for doing so. As for asking why would one want to make it up, the internet is full of stories people have made up. Just browse this site for a while.
But, since you've asked me to read the subsequent comments, I can't help noticing a lot express surprise at how bone-headed a mistake by the provider it is (i.e. that it is considered anomalous, though you quite rightly say none state they doubt the story as a result). Many more say you'd have to be mad to not take any data backups yourself no matter who you are with, which is a bit more than making sure you know what you are getting from a cloud provider.
A pig in a poke.
Serious developers just don't use cheap backup solutions, nor cheap cloud providers. There are certainly loads of horror stories around but anybody taking a professional approach is going to know exactly what their SLAs are, what failure and failover processes are in place, and how quickly full recovery will take place in any given situation. The first comments on the link you provide are along the lines of "why on earth are you blaming the provider - you chose them", and that's pretty much going to be the attitude of most pros.
The kind of people that get caught out are DIYers who are just taking the cheapest solution without really understanding what they are buying. In the same way that a company would be generally ill-advised to DIY their own accounts and tax, so they will be setting themselves up for a fall if they start trying to implement their own Cloud/SaaS system without professional help.
And a professional just won't make that kind of mistake.
Absolutely right ….
@James Reeves – but surely the point is that those on this site are not ‘.. serious developers ..’ – for the most part they are users and have to rely upon third parties taking a professional approach
Anyway in the early days of ASP/SaaS many of the providers (2000-2005 - before Xero – less than a handful) were ‘winging it’ with delivery, backups, redundancy etc. because that’s the way these things happen in the real world, where money is tight. Proper in-house infrastructure etc. was unaffordable to start-ups and they themselves needed to offload onto third parties where there was no real control and they needed to rely upon trust
Try an open enquiry on how many members on this site know the SLA’s of their services and I bet few know the terms – the real question here is should users be aware of providers SLA’s and chose their selection of provider on this basis or is it irrelevant - do they even know the questions to ask? On the other hand keep it simple and ask what the uptime guarantee of their service is ... how many know this
Unfortunately one has to take much of this on trust and you never know whether this is misplaced until things go wrong – quite frankly is the response ‘.. you chose the provider so it is your fault ..’ really acceptable as anything other than a cop-out?
As for ‘.. And a professional just won't make that kind of mistake ..’ – yes they do because they are fallible like everyone else! But it never comes to light until it’s too late - even then, as the original question demonstrates, the provider ducks & dives without coming clean
Just as an aside – how many providers have both redundancy and also restore backups on a 24 hour cycle to ensure they work
EDIT
Presumably these are the same ‘.. serious developers ..’ who still have code susceptible to SQL injection because they don’t use prepared statements or stored procedures – oversights/bad decisions happen and ignoring them by burying one’s head in the sand doesn’t make them go away?
Not upset – just boring …
With so many of your replies to almost anyone’s posting on this forum, the same ‘.. prove it – give source ..’ stance is trotted out ad-nauseam as your response, like an auto-responder; rather than addressing the topic at hand – after a while it becomes not only boring but also predictable
In this particular instance it was followed up with ‘.. my experience tells me ..’ - being uncharitable one could say – what experience, ‘.. verify it ..’ - and followed up by the fact that you could be '.. telling an unsubstantiated tale ..'
Your experience! is really even more questionable than someone not providing a chapter & verse reference in the first place; especially as the subsequent comments about backups demonstrate lack of understanding and are highly dubious
Even when provided with a reference source you continue to question it, saying that the author could still have made it up and furthermore you have never heard of a website that has been around since about 2000 (15 years)
The point here is that you question others sources whilst at the same time being prepared to provide your own gratuitous unsubstantiated (often incorrect IT) opinion/value judgement - seemingly based on your own unverified experience (and friends/family in the business!) and expect anyone to give it credence
So one rule for you and another for everyone else!
We won’t even go into flaws in the statement ‘.. noting that the story is talking about a website (so not a cloud backup anyway) ..’ because the whole thing is just too tiresome!