The stupidity continues

The stupidity continues

Didn't find your answer?

I was trying to make a comment. I was blocked. I wasn't posting links or anything. It would appear that Sift are totally incompetent. Why block my comment? I've shown how they can avoid this but they don't seem to be dealing with it sensibly. 

Replies (100)

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By tom123
04th Jul 2015 07:09

How do they decide

Wonder how it decides - surely you should be on the 'safe senders' list by now Peter :)

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By petersaxton
04th Jul 2015 07:26

Safe senders list

I don't think Sift have thought any of this through. It seems that they think that random blocking is a good idea.

Sift are a perfect example of a business that cannot deal with problems. I wonder if they have recruited FirstTab to be their problem solver? Have a look at FirstTab's blog if you want to see a comment that shows a total lack of understanding followed by Shirley's sensible comment. If you want to know why some businesses limp from crisis to crisis while other businesses can be successful effortlessly his latest blog illustrates the gulf.

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RLI
By lionofludesch
04th Jul 2015 10:12

Blocked

Yes - I've been blocked at times.  Other times I can post.

Baffling.

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By User deleted
04th Jul 2015 10:48

I couldn't even ...

... make an OP on my own blog!! (presumably because I was trying to share a cool summer tune with you guys)

Surely a registered blogger should be vetted and exempted!

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Replying to frankfx:
By ShirleyM
04th Jul 2015 12:43

Wouldn't that make you a 'gold star' member?

Old Greying Accountant wrote:

... make an OP on my own blog!! (presumably because I was trying to share a cool summer tune with you guys)

Surely a registered blogger should be vetted and exempted!

I think your suggestion is sensible, but others think it would create a 'class divide'.

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By cparker87
04th Jul 2015 11:53

Acceptance

.

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By ShirleyM
04th Jul 2015 12:08

It would be helpful

... if Mollom informed you why your post was blocked.

If you are doing something wrong then how can you change without feedback, or is there no feedback because people are being stopped from doing something that wasn't wrong in the first  place?

As for not allowing any links at all ... I dare not complain else Mollom will extinguish me (and I'll end up annoying a few members who complain about the complaints - now there's an oxymoron for you). :)

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By petersaxton
04th Jul 2015 12:37

Sift act like

they have no control over Mollom or the possible settings are not very sensible.

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Ben sitting at a We Work Anywhere office
By Ben Smith
04th Jul 2015 12:44

Why your post is blocked.. or not

Hi Guys,

Couple of points to add..

@ ShirleyM - I'd love to tell everyone why an individual post has been blocked. At the same time we don't want to give the spam crowd the tips they need to get a post through.

@PeterSaxton - You've been a member a long time, and I think we've even met once or twice over the years. I appreciate your feedback as you've always tried to be balanced and reasonable in your comments. On this occasion, I don't share your opinion about the way we run our site, or the way we make decisions. Granted. the onsite experience for members has been up and down over the last couple of weeks, but what you're not seeing is the number of blocked accounts, posts and comments that the moderation tactics we use have prevented from appearing on site. 

We know we've got more work to do, and we have a talented and committed team delivering new fixes every day. I know it's frustrating for regular users, but please bear with us, we'll get there.

Have a good weekend, and do remember to  email member services if you have an issue, and you can PM me with any feedback.

here's the member services email address: [email protected] 

 

Ben Smith, AccountingWEB UK

 

 

 

 

 

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By cparker87
04th Jul 2015 13:02

How did you post an e-mail?

That is surely spam. I will try it

 

[email protected]

[email protected]

www . bbc . co. uk

 

So basically any URL link whatsoever is spam.

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By User deleted
04th Jul 2015 16:09

What an intolerant bunch ....

... must be the heat.

As Ben says, we don't know what crud is getting caught in their net, if temporarily we can't post links because the post we want to make gets caught with the 10,000 spam posts happening at the same time then suck it up and wait whilst things are sorted.

If the link is that important then type it out without the internet bits

And listen to this to chill out whilst you wait

youtube dot com forward slash watch?v=SJ5cg0KNKH0

 

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By User deleted
04th Jul 2015 16:20

Thanks Tom ...

... as well being a cracking tune for a summer's day, I liked the irony of the lyrics too!

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By petersaxton
04th Jul 2015 16:47

What a silly bunch

If you think it's only links that are blocked by spam then you have as much brains as spam.

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By User deleted
04th Jul 2015 16:53

Peter ..

.. i am worried about you, you seem to be turning in to Victor Meldrew, and insulting everyone constantly is not becoming.

Sift are having problems, they are trying to sort it so we can use their FREE service as we wish, so give them a chance and stop throwing your toys out the pram.

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Replying to gainsborough:
By petersaxton
04th Jul 2015 18:10

Not logical

Old Greying Accountant wrote:

.. i am worried about you, you seem to be turning in to Victor Meldrew, and insulting everyone constantly is not becoming.

Sift are having problems, they are trying to sort it so we can use their FREE service as we wish, so give them a chance and stop throwing your toys out the pram.

So why do you think Sift are not making use of a white list? I have asked them but as yet they haven't said. Many people have suggest it but all Sift can say is that they are working hard to solve the problem.

If you had to look at an organisations accounts and nothing made sense and they kept telling you how bad the problem is but couldn't tell you why they are not doing the obvious would you be reassured?

Insulting everybody? I don't think that is accurate.

Some people have suggested a white list but FirstTab seems to think that would be "devisive", 

You complain that you can't post on your own blog and then you criticise others for complaining! You call us an intolerant bunch. You think that we should wait while Sift sort out the problem but the evidence available is that Sift don't have the expertise or ability to solve the problem. Why should they introduce a "solution" which seems to be that posts are blocked on a random basis?

Ben says: "Granted. the onsite experience for members has been up and down over the last couple of weeks, but what you're not seeing is the number of blocked accounts, posts and comments that the moderation tactics we use have prevented from appearing on site." What we are not seeing from Ben is an explanation of why totally innocent posts are being blocked. Blaming "over zealous software" is just not good enough. If the spammers can see an inadequate response from Sift they are likely to target them more than if they seem to know what they are doing.

I have seen some comments that are just ridiculous. People have said that they dont think they should take notice of members who give common sense advice because they are not trained in spam detection and prevention. If I saw somebody drowning in a river and nobody was helping them would I be wrong to make suggestions to people who should be saving the individual because I couldn't swim?

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Replying to gainsborough:
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By andy.partridge
04th Jul 2015 20:24

FREE service?

Old Greying Accountant wrote:

.. i am worried about you, you seem to be turning in to Victor Meldrew, and insulting everyone constantly is not becoming.

Sift are having problems, they are trying to sort it so we can use their FREE service as we wish, so give them a chance and stop throwing your toys out the pram.


Unbelievable! There is nothing more precious than my time. Does yours have no value? Don't worry about Peter, I'm far more worried about you.
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Replying to gainsborough:
Quack
By Constantly Confused
06th Jul 2015 10:07

#Fanfare#

Old Greying Accountant wrote:

Sift are having problems, they are trying to sort it so we can use their FREE service as we wish, so give them a chance and stop throwing your toys out the pram.

#Trumpets blare#

Congratulations Sir/madam, you have been awarded with the prestigious 'only sane person plaque for posting a sensible comment in this thread!  There was a danger that your title would be taken from you, what with the further page or so of posts that followed, however a quick skim confirms that you retain your title!

#Crowd goes wild/angels descend from heaven/exit pursued by bear#

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Man of Kent
By Kent accountant
04th Jul 2015 17:00

Life is too short
Get out and enjoy the sunshine.

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By andy.partridge
04th Jul 2015 20:13

User experience is at the heart of Sift's decision making, apparently. My user experience over the past week has been the worst I've known. I don't see why it is wrong to criticise. Why should I be interested in how or why it has happened? That's for insiders and those with a specialist interest to discuss.
I also find it amusing that one or two rebels are turning into sycophants. Most odd.

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RLI
By lionofludesch
04th Jul 2015 20:33

I'm blocked again

Fourth time.

So anyone waiting for the benefit of my advice on time limits - you're in luck.

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By petersaxton
04th Jul 2015 22:19

Blocking

One member complains about being blocked and then follows it up by complaining about other members complaining about being blocked.

Another member tries to post valuable advice and is blocked.

Sift tell us they are doing a lot behind the scenes but seem unable to explain why they are not doing the obvious of creating a white list of members who would not get blocked.

Another member criticises people who suggest creating a white list because it would create different classes of members. He seems proud to be an "economy member" which appears to mean he wants to receive advice but gives very little.

But there's light at the end of the tunnel. Sift are considering hiding content behind big blobs. I wouldn't be surprised if within a few months AccountingWeb will be full of people asking how to submit a set of accounts to Companies House working out the figures individually as they arrive at them on the online template or saying they've done a bookkeeping course and now they want to know how to get clients who would want them to prepare their accounts and tax.

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By User deleted
05th Jul 2015 00:29

There is criticism ...

... and there are foot-stamping tantrums like a three year told he can't have any sweets!

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Replying to HudsonCo:
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By andy.partridge
05th Jul 2015 09:58

Mistaken

Old Greying Accountant wrote:

... and there are foot-stamping tantrums like a three year told he can't have any sweets!

Your are mistaken if you think your interpretation of someone's post is the only interpretation. Talk of tantrums and toys and prams can be a crude tactic to smear a poster with whom you disagree. If you can cut out the personal stuff, does Peter have a valid point? Of course he does. You agreed with him so to make him appear clownish is counter-productive.
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Replying to Tax Dragon:
Portia profile image
By Portia Nina Levin
05th Jul 2015 10:27

Absolutely

andy.partridge wrote:

Talk of tantrums and toys and prams can be a crude tactic to smear a poster with whom you disagree..

In the interest of balance though I would make the observation that the people complaining about the over-zealous spam blocking this weekend, are, with one absentee, the same people that were complaining about the lack of response to the spam last weekend

I wonder what Abraham Lincoln might say. :)

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Replying to Paul Morton:
By petersaxton
05th Jul 2015 10:43

I think he would say something like

Portia Nina Levin wrote:
andy.partridge wrote:

Talk of tantrums and toys and prams can be a crude tactic to smear a poster with whom you disagree..

In the interest of balance though I would make the observation that the people complaining about the over-zealous spam blocking this weekend, are, with one absentee, the same people that were complaining about the lack of response to the spam last weekend

I wonder what Abraham Lincoln might say. :)

"This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or exercise their revolutionary right to overthrow it."

Of course they are the same people. If a lack of response is wrong it doesn't mean ANY response is right.

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By petersaxton
05th Jul 2015 07:19

Can anybody explain why no white list in place?

Or is the conventional wisdom from the "Sift are Wonderful" people that a white list is impossible?

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By petersaxton
05th Jul 2015 07:41

White list

LINK BLOCKED

Maybe some people don't even understand what a white list is.

LINK BLOCKED

"Using the Blacklist and Whitelist"

Use the blacklist to block spammers, offensive commenters and/or those who violate your commenting policy. This will block the user from posting future comments and give you the option to retroactively delete their comments from the past 30 days.

Whitelisting will ensure that their comments are posted immediately though it won't prevent their comments from being marked as spam. This is used for trusted commenters, such as community regulars or website staff who aren't listed as moderators."

 

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By Ken Howard
05th Jul 2015 08:15

Just blocked a link to HMRC webpage

I really can't be bothered with Aweb anymore.  Just tried to add to a discussion and include a webpage link to the gov uk website and Aweb blocked it.  This site is dead in the water if long established members can't post a weblink to a government website.

The internet is all about links to other webpages.  A blanket ban on any links is plain crazy.  A whitelist for "approved" websites is a basic minimum, such as for HMRC, gov . uk etc for an accountancy website.

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By ShirleyM
05th Jul 2015 08:30

Criticism

If the criticism is constructive, then I don't see a problem with it. The alternative is to stop posting if you aren't seeing any improvement..

It would be interesting to know how the post count has changed since Mollom was introduced.

Why was Mollom abandoned last time around? There was mass criticism last time. Isn't there any spam prevention that won't block valid posts? Mollom is falsely marking valid posts as spam. How can anyone think that is acceptable? If Mollom can't be trained to accept AWeb & HMRC links, then it's useless for this forum. The only workaround would be to have a 'white list', as has been suggested by several people.

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Replying to Rgab1947:
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By andy.partridge
05th Jul 2015 10:01

Mollom

ShirleyM wrote:

Why was Mollom abandoned last time around?

Don't expect Sift to know. Apart from John S they were all still at school when it was last used.
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By petersaxton
05th Jul 2015 08:29

Wow

Maybe they do have a limited white list in place! I was expecting to be blocked from posting a link to AccountingWeb's homepage!

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Replying to AndrewV12:
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By Ken Howard
05th Jul 2015 08:34

just tried gov . uk - definitely still

 blocked

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By cheekychappy
05th Jul 2015 08:33

Well said OGA.

Has anyone tried contacting Ben or Member Services? Or do they just like to use the platform that is Any Answers to have a good old moan?

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Replying to bendybod:
By petersaxton
05th Jul 2015 08:47

Now you mention it

cheekychappy wrote:
Well said OGA. Has anyone tried contacting Ben or Member Services? Or do they just like to use the platform that is Any Answers to have a good old moan?

I sent an email to "member services" and this was the reply:

"Your request (1101) has been received and is being reviewed by our support staff.

To add additional comments, reply to this email."

 

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By ShirleyM
05th Jul 2015 08:40

Well, while we are having a good old moan

Why are people such hypocrites? It seems odd that people moan about other people moaning while having a good old moan themselves.

Is it a case of 'do as I say' ?

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By cheekychappy
05th Jul 2015 08:44

I haven't yet started a thread moaning about something.

Yet Mr Saxton has managed several in the last few days. Some would even call it Spam.

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Replying to [email protected]:
By petersaxton
05th Jul 2015 09:05

Maybe it's because

cheekychappy wrote:
I haven't yet started a thread moaning about something. Yet Mr Saxton has managed several in the last few days. Some would even call it Spam.

Maybe it's because Mollom is less likely to block an OP than a comment! No, I don't know why that is either.

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By petersaxton
05th Jul 2015 08:49

That's funny

Mr cheekychappy said he couldn't comment because he wasn't trained in detecting spam!

Has he been on a quick training course?

 

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By cheekychappy
05th Jul 2015 08:52

I said I couldn't comment on ideas to prevent spam.
I have no qualifications or experience in this field. Nor do I have any desire to tell people how to do their job.

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Replying to exceljockey:
By petersaxton
05th Jul 2015 09:23

Cop out

cheekychappy wrote:
I said I couldn't comment on ideas to prevent spam. I have no qualifications or experience in this field. Nor do I have any desire to tell people how to do their job.

You said: "I am not trained in detecting and preventing spam."

You seem to be confusing telling people how to do their job with making suggestions. I have no qualifications or experience in running a big organisation like HMRC but I don't think that should preclude me from voicing my opinion that they shouldn't ditch experienced staff for cheaper inexperienced staff.

Your comment seems like a total cop out. What if my response was that you had no qualifications, training or experience in running a community web site so you shouldn't comment on my contributions!?

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By ShirleyM
05th Jul 2015 08:57

Fed up

You may not think Peter's moans are justified. Others do.

I have just been blocked (no swear words, no links) from making a response. I'm totally fed up with AWeb.

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By cheekychappy
05th Jul 2015 09:03

I never said they weren't justified. I just think they could be directed somewhere better.

If you're that fed up, try coming off the site for a couple of hours and spend a bit of time with your family. I'm sure you will feel better for it.

That's what I'll be doing now. Peace out!

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Replying to uahmed:
By petersaxton
05th Jul 2015 09:13

Where is this better place?

cheekychappy wrote:
I never said they weren't justified. I just think they could be directed somewhere better. If you're that fed up, try coming off the site for a couple of hours and spend a bit of time with your family. I'm sure you will feel better for it. That's what I'll be doing now. Peace out!

Is this the place where you send a message to "member services" and they don't respond? Is it reading Ben Smith telling everybody how hard they are working to deal with spam but they seem to need to break the site without trying the obvious solutions first. They still haven't explained why they are not using a white list. I can't imagine that would help the spammers. If the reason is "We don't know how to do it" then I suppose it would be useful for spammers to know!

My wife and dog have gone for a morning walk in the countryside. I am at home - not spending every minute on AccountingWeb - but doing some paying accounting work. I'm not exactly a touch typist but some people must think I'm a very slow typist if they think it takes long to type what I produce here. Maybe they are factoring in the other 90% which is getting blocked!

 

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By ShirleyM
05th Jul 2015 09:28

I'm going to stop caring

I'm like this with clients. I care more about their deadlines than they do.

I am going to stop caring about AWeb. If members get fed up and leave, then so be it. 

It would help if we had more info from AWeb, ie. they are working towards stopping valid posts being blocked as spam and allowing links. All we get is 'we can't tell you anything because it would help the spammers', which doesn't help at all. The blocking is really REALLY frustrating. If we had an explanation why it was blocked then it wouldn't be so frustrating, but that would help the spammers! Why am I a suspected spammer? It really doesn't give the 'good user experience' that AWeb say is so important!

 

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By User deleted
05th Jul 2015 09:48

Judging by ...

... the SPAM on this thread Mollom isn't working!

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By andy.partridge
05th Jul 2015 10:33

Strange that there should be an absentee. Neither flood nor drought are happy outcomes.

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By andy.partridge
05th Jul 2015 10:49

Absenteeism is not a vote for anything. On the contrary. Taken to its extreme, absenteeism means nobody cares, nobody posts, nobody mourns the death of AccountingWeb..

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By Marion Hayes
05th Jul 2015 11:14

Hi Portia - keeping well?

To add my twopenn'th - I am not computer minded being a dinosaur and perhaps I only see what I want to see but

Isn't it only by looking at blocked items that you can then create a black/white list?

Didn't they say early on that the 'temporary' reintroduction of something was having to learn good and bad from scratch?  and that the fewer clues the spammers got the less likely they would be to manage such a successful attack again?

Lots of people post links to other Aweb threads - and if I get an email with links to HMRC I always assume it is spam too!!

Plus I could never post links anyway and apart from a couple of Captchas (?) I haven't been blocked either

 

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By petersaxton
05th Jul 2015 11:46

No it is not

"Isn't it only by looking at blocked items that you can then create a black/white list?"

You can create a white list of members based on their past. How long they have been members and how active they are.

The above has just been blocked as spam. Maybe this addition will mean it is accepted.

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