What’s so good about IRIS?

What’s so good about IRIS?

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I’m a sole practitioner with one part time member of staff and I also use two subcontractors on a part time basis.

I currently use VT for accounts preparation and Taxcalc for tax. I’m quite happy with these products but as my practice grows I’m looking for a more comprehensive package with a practice management element.

I’ve looked at BTC and like the way it works. Previously I always discounted IRIS as I thought it was too expensive. After speaking to a few AWEB forum members last night I’m starting to change this view.

The annual cost of say £3,000 for 100 clients (single user) as against say £1,000 for VT and BTC suddenly doesn’t look that bad. An additional £20 per client is a cost which (in my view) could easily be recovered through increased efficiency allowing more work to be completed with the same level of staff/subcontractor overhead.

So, I’d be interested to hear from IRIS users in small practices, preferably sole practitioners and how it works for them and why I should make the change.

Replies (22)

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Red Leader
By Red Leader
12th Oct 2012 10:44

efficiency

I think you know my view but for the sake of the discussion, I thought I'd record it here.

First, my knowledge of competing packages is not very good. But having used IRIS for over 10 years, I've not really had cause to think of changing.

IRIS enables me to maximise the amount of returns/accounts/etc that I get out the door in a given amount of time. If that means you bill an extra £100 that day, it soon pays for itself. The reason I went with IRIS initially and remain with them is the integration. There are so many examples of this, but for instance: enter the fixed asset addition in the FAR, it then works out the depreciation and the addition also turns up when you come to do the capital allowances. Do a P11D and the bik figures turn up in the SATR together with the expense claim if appropriate. And so on.

A feature that I like about the accounts module - and this may be a feature in the competition, I don't know - is that you can do all the entries in Excel and then import to IRIS. So for example, all the journal entries and client TB if applicable I do in Excel. In year 2, it's often a case of using the same journal entries but with updated figures. It becomes a very efficient operation.

For those not familiar with the IRIS pricing structure, the 100 clients Kent mentions is 100 accounts clients which in turn gives a licence for 200 SA returns. The starter pack includes the following modules: accounts, personal tax, business tax, fixed asset register, P11D. Don't even think of buying IRIS for just one module and then using another provider for a different module. IRIS's big benefit is the integration.

 

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Teignmouth
By Paul Scholes
12th Oct 2012 10:44

Integration

Hi (again) just to pad out some chats last night.

Not having used other systems I can't say how good or bad Iris is in terms of preparing a tax return or set of accounts in comparison to anything else, but this stuff works find for me and there's not much that Iris can't handle.

Where I feel it does (and always has) won out is in terms of integration, ie it keeps everything in one place, whether it be monitoring client work or even internal processes of the firm and it's Practice Management bit, which holds everything together, is worth as much as all the "doing" bits.

As I said, I'm now a sole practitioner with one S-C (who probably deals with the management and compliance work of 30% of my clients) and we can each see what's happening on any client and, in particular, what the timescales are to finish a piece of work and what we are still waiting for if a job has been suspended (eg outstanding info from the client).

I have one screen open all day with all my clients & their "jobs" (eg tax returns, accounts, quotes, Annual returns etc etc) showing and can examine monitor, interrogate & update anything on any client, from that one screen. 

This is exactly what I need in my current situation, especially as my S-C and I work 50 miles apart in "the Cloud", but was essential when monitoring hundreds of clients and 5-6 staff.

On the doing side, in addition to the tax/accounts I particularly value Company Secretarial, Company formations and Automail (which generates tailoured letters or internal checklists based on the client and firm's info on the database).

Given their standing in supplying half of the UK's accountants with software Iris are always looking to be ahead of impending changes both in terms of legislation and in where they see the profession going, ie making sure they anticipate what we will be doing, and how, in the future and, in some respects, they drive change (have a look at their "Open Apps").

They don't always get it right, their updates will always need bedding in and corrective sub releases and I'm not alone in having ripped out chunks of hair every now & then at not being able to understand "how in hell did they miss that", or "why won't it do that any more" but I'm not sure that's any different from other suppliers, it's just part of building software that has to cope with constantly changing legislation and practice.

Happy to have a chat or PM over any detailed aspects.

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Replying to jcace:
Red Leader
By Red Leader
12th Oct 2012 11:02

Automail

Paul reminds me that I forgot to mention the Automail module which is part of the IRIS Starter pack. Again, efficiency. Do the SATR, then print a standard letter which, in the case of the one I use, will include the client name, client address, tax liabilities and UTR data that are needed to customise the letter for that client.

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By wilcoskip
12th Oct 2012 12:30

Love it

I first trained on IRIS back when it was on a DOS system in about 1999.  I used it a few years later as a manger at a different practice, and I use it for my own practice now.  In the meantime I've used PTP, SAGE an Digita for year-end accounts prep and tax, and for my money IRIS is on top.

Money is often quoted as an issue for a lot of people arguing against IRIS, but for the benefits it brings I don't really see an issue.  Even if it works out £2k or £3k more expensive than a cheaper option, that's not much in the grand scheme of things for the clients I work for and the fees I charge (not that I'm overly expensive or cheap - probably about average.)

The integration is great, the central database is great, the software is intuitive, and it gets the job done easily and quickly.  Online filing for Companies House and the Revenue is a breeze.

Software is one of those areas where it's horses for courses, and people do seem to get a full head of steam about it, but try it out and see if it works for you. 

WS.

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Man of Kent
By Kent accountant
12th Oct 2012 12:35

All in one

@Red Leader, it was our conversation which really made me want to look at IRIS properly.

The TB functionality which you mentioned would work really well with VT Transaction+ which I use for bookkeeping.

@Paul, its a lot of the add ins which you mention which appeal. I definitely would go for a comprehensive package as I feel I waste too much time at the moment exporting data to Taxcalc from VT, filing abbreviated accounts via CH, using spreadsheets to track work flow.

I'll have more of a think and PM you both.

 

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By User deleted
12th Oct 2012 14:07

I've used it for...

over 10 years with two difference employers.  One being a large independent with roughly 2,500 clients and the and the other a small practice with roughly 400 clients.

In my experience it works well for the small practitioner.  The integration for the majority of the time is flawless and you will notice a time saving.  The biggest problem I have found with Iris (and I am sure this applies to other software developers too) is that they seem to put out an update without really testing it and fixing small bugs seems to take them forever.

We have recently moved to Iris open hosting which has not been without its problems (ie Iris severs down, occasional loss of internet connection and just being very slow).  It does give you the freedom to work away from the office but if you lose your internet connection you are unable to access open hosting.

At my former employer with circa 2,500 client on the database it didn't run particularly well and  we were constantly on the phone to Iris with problems.  Iris did inform us that we were running very close to the working capacity of Iris at that level of clients.  This was 5 or 6 years ago so things may have changed, but something to bear in mind.

If I was to set up on my own would I use it?...........yes I probably would.

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By justsotax
12th Oct 2012 14:18

Its good...but

expensive....

 

From a tax point of view i think digita is better....but that is not an integrated system in the trus sense (as far as i understand it)....more that the different functions have been bolted together.

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Replying to SteveHa:
By petersaxton
12th Oct 2012 19:37

Integrated

justsotax wrote:

expensive....

From a tax point of view i think digita is better....but that is not an integrated system in the trus sense (as far as i understand it)....more that the different functions have been bolted together.

Digita is integrated in the sense that the data is passed from one program to another. The programs have been developed with integration in mind. If you change a taxpayers address in Practice Management it will not flow through into Personal Tax before you give the ok. If you prepare the accounts in Accounts Production the accounts won't flow through into Corporation Tax unless you specifically request them to be imported. Digita, with this weeks update of Company Secretarial, means that Practice Management, Company Secretarial, Personal Tax and Corporation Tax all have the look and feel of Outlook. Accounts Production doesn't lend itself to the same look but it is similar.

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By kirsty1986
12th Oct 2012 14:39

I previously worked with IRIS in a small firm and I agree with all the above comments relating to efficiency and integration.  The IRIS system is really comprehensive and can be a one-stop shop for all the information and programmes you need.  The accounts production system is easy to use, and the flow through of information to business and personal tax means that late adjustments are easily processed throughout all streams.  The IRIS system also hosts all the client information you need including client details and correspondence.  I've since used other accounting packages (Sage, caseware, etc) but have never felt these other packages come close.

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By ireallyshouldknowthisbut
12th Oct 2012 15:15

.

I think it depends how big your clients are and how big a practice you have how much benefit there is for a full integrated system vs doing it "on the cheap" with VT and Taxcalc for £1k all in.

The bigger and more complex the client, and the bigger and more complex the organisation you are, the more benefit you will get.

Lots of Aweb users are sole pracs or sole pracs + 1 dealing with simple clients, so integration is not a huge gain. If you have a junior, a manger and a partner looking at each file and are dealing with bigger clients its going to be a different picture.

@ Kent Accountant from what you have said about your practice you seem to be a prime candidate for IRIS.

I on the other hand probably could only do with it for our largest 3 or 4 clients who quite frankly dont fit into our business model but I do because I like them! For most of what we do it would be overkill.

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Teignmouth
By Paul Scholes
12th Oct 2012 15:33

PS re PM

I had a couple of chats last week @ Irisworld with practices who were paying for Practice Management but had never implemented it and now dreaded the time it would take setting up all the standard jobs and allocating each to clients & staff.

I can still remember how much time we invested when it was first launched with several hundred clients.  If you are going to do it therefore it makes sense when you have only a small number of clients/people as it can then grow with you.

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By petersaxton
12th Oct 2012 15:43

Iris v Digita

I listened to the discussion last night about Iris. They didn't seem as expensive as I thought they were.

I have looked back and it would appear that I have had Digita for about seven years. When I was considering an integrated package I looked at Iris and Digita. I went to presentation of both. I preferred Digita. This was mainly due to Digita being more flexible. I think Iris Practice Management is useable out of the box whereas there is more setting up required in Digita Practice Management but you can get it to do exactly what you want.

I would recommend that you ask both Iris and Digita for a demonstration. I know that Digita do online demonstrations. It would help if you prepare notes of what you do now to manage your business and then you can ask the demonstrator how easy it would be to reproduce that or improve on it.

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By AccSec
12th Oct 2012 17:34

Can IRIS Starter pack do the following too?

I have been following the reviewers with their comments and the OP has made some very interesting points on why Iris may be the way forward due to it's core strength of integration versus the costs of separate software

Whilst we do not come across certain aspects in tax work too often, there are times when we have following situations:

1. Profits/Losses on share disposals by individuals

2. Tax Losses and how best to utilise losses when client may have made profits in earliers year(s) or is likely to make profits in future

3. Disposal of BTL (or Private residence) properties and making profits or losses for CGT purposes  on such disposals

Does IRIS allow for such computation as standard within the starter package or do you need ot purchase extra modules for these? Tax Tool Tips are very good for such one off calculations but again it is the concept of fragmentation and costs similar to VT & Tax Calc. that comes to mind.

Your thoughts will be appreciated.

 

 

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By User deleted
12th Oct 2012 18:06

The starter pack is the same software ...

... it is just the core (essential) modules limited to a number of clients.

You can add on any other modules or increase the number of clients as you need to.

Personal Tax will handle 1 - 3, unless a company, in which case Business Tax will for 2. You get these and Accounts production with starter pack lite. Personal tax will include the P11D module.

For losses the default is carry forward, but you have the option to carry back or to set against other income in a very simple way.

Have a look here

http://accountancy-practice.iris.co.uk/iris-accountancy-suite/editions-available.aspx

The biggest problem people have with IRIS is that you have to treat the business different from the person, so you have two ID's for one job, the business and the trader which need to be linked. The trade has the accounts done in accounts production, you open up business tax to do your personal allowances, private use adjustments etc then click a button to "refresh" personal tax where the info pops in to the personal record of teh trader. You can add in dividends, interest, pension premiums etc and then print your return. The beauty is, if they take on a partner you just open up a personal tax case for them and link it to the trade, withthe date admited and the system apportions the profit for you.

 

 

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By User deleted
12th Oct 2012 19:54

True integration ...

... is what IRIS gives.

There is a single SQL database so the standing data is accessible to all programs instantly, this is of most use in automaill as you can prepare letters drawing data from all modules, which you can set up in a template easily. Also useful for Practice management as you can "mine" data across all modules by setting search criteria from all modules as required.

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By petersaxton
12th Oct 2012 20:42

Maybe Digita doesn't have a single database, but

you can prepare letters/emails in Practice Management (which has the static data) or Personal Tax.

Digita also have a data mining tool http://digita.com/pro2011/software/data-mining/default.aspx

 

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By mrshamilton
12th Oct 2012 22:46

What about PTP instead?  I

What about PTP instead?  I believe it uses the same platform as Iris with some of the functionality that only larger practices would find useful removed - and it's cheaper?

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By janefg
25th Oct 2012 12:08

Support

We have been using IRIS for 15 years since the days of Windows 3.1 and wouldn't change.  What nobody has mentioned so far is that their support is excellent.  We have had help from them not just with technical problems but also with print problems and complete computer malfunctions.

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By hiu612
25th Oct 2012 14:04

Digita Support

Is also excellent, in my experience. We use a combination of CCH and Digita products and support for the Digita ones is superior by far.

No experience with IRIS though. . .

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By Pozzer6
27th Oct 2012 17:48

Iris is great
I am a sole practitioner and moved from Caseware and PTP (which were both good) around 3 years ago. The integration is the best bit - only having to input information once (mostly).
Currently thinking about moving payroll from Sage to Iris for the same reasons - any comments from anyone on their payroll software?

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By User deleted
27th Oct 2012 23:39

Pozzer ...

... do it, but get the just launched payroll for accountants - looks great and has quite a bit of integration with practice suite, although unfortunately not yet with automail and practice management.

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By AccSec
28th Oct 2012 10:47

CIS subbie accounts

We prepare a fair few Accounts for subbie clients in construction Industry together with PAYE income returns with claims for employment expenses. The fees are typically low. As their Accounts & Tax Returns are relatively straightforward, I cannot imagine that the starter pack cositng £3000 for 100 clients (200 SA Returns) will be beneficial, will it? For those practitioners that use IRIS more comprehensively, what sort of costs are you then looking on an annual basis? Do IRIS have unlimited clients and unlimited multi user licences that will allow for such number crunching style work? As dreamcatcher above says, with 2500 clients (we don't have numbers like these I can assure you), IRIS was beginning to work close to it's capacity (that was 5-6 yrs ago), but does anyone have any experience of whether they have resolved these problem now? What about regular updates that may not be fully tested. Have IRIS gotten better at putting out fully tested updates now?

When you then start adding the cost of purchasing modules on Practice Management, Payroll, Company Secretarial, would the costs not start mounting considerably?

In my last employment many moons ago , I always used to hate coding entries using Accounts package (used to be Finax Gold if anyone remembers that package now) and then find that the Statutory Accounts did not balance (rounding off difference) and we had to manually check the totals (before the client found out!!). I would imagine these problems or errors don't exist on IRIS?

I would probably imagine that IRIS would be extremely beneficial and cost effective to those practitioners that charge high fee per client but  the client numbers are few. Do you agree?

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