I am qualified ACCA. I have 5 years experience in Practice and more than 10 years experience in Industry. Last year I was offered a job starting up a new Accountancy Practice for a business who has two companies dealing with Financial Advise and Asset Managment.
This opportunity was too good too miss, unfortunatly I did not at that point have a practice licence with ACCA. I deregistered with ACCA and I used my pracice licence with AAT.
I also built up a handful of my own clients.
I am now in the situation where I cannot see a way back into ACCA. I would need to give up my own clients and my boss would need to employ someone with a practice licence so that I could give up mine. I would then need at least three years supervision before I could apply for a practice licence.
I have had a look at other bodies such as IFA and ICPA and am thinking of joining them but I am hesitant because I am not sure how professional they are.
Any advice or suggestions would be grafteful.
Thank you
Cath
Replies (39)
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ICPA
Go with ICPA. Far more useful, and, dare I say it, more professional than ACCA. I quit ACCA and haven't regretted it since. Conversely I've never resented handing over money to ICPA - but then Tony doesn't feel the need to spend thousands on changing the logo ever-so-slightly or gloating about having lots of new members in countries I've never even considered visiting on holiday while ignoring the ones in the home nation (probably because he's too busy talking to HMRC on behalf of small practices and negotiating new benefits for members).
I'd choose ICPA over IFA. Just from personal experience of one, and what other accountants say about the other!
For the record, I'm neither, I'm AAT.
ICPA prove very populat on here - a simple search will uncover lots of glowing recommendations.
Worth a look :)
Challenges of ACCA
Interesting that everything I read about ACCA is NOT glowing. Being an ACCA member for a long time I'm currently having issues with ACCA regarding a practicing certificate. They don't lend themselves to Management Accountants at all well and as for their levels of communications - abysmal. It seems they don't want me to resign though? Whatever happens I will be writing to the CEO.
Thankfully I'm also AAT and they appear to be superior in their Member care.
Not protected
The word 'accountant' isn't protected. Anyone can use it. Is it a condition of your AAT licence that you don't use it?I just feel that I would like to use the name "Accountant".
Many People let them go
I did AAT then CIMA, but found they were not that much help just a large cost. The main bodies are particularly difficult with sole traders/small accountants around PC and governance which is why many people look to ICPA and IFA as they are more supportive and you actually get help for your annual fees and not hindrance. I was with IFA when doing things part time as they do my AML cover but I may look to switch over to ICPA as it certainly looks good value for money, and gets a lot of good reviews of AWEB members.
Another...
Have a look at The Associatian of International Accountants - they're a RQB (Recognised Qualifying Body) under the Companies Acts.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_qualified_accountants
I believe they offer full exam exemption to CAAB qualified accountants.
ICPA
I joined ICPA because I never managed to qualify (personal reasons). Have worked in own business for 30 years with no problems. When my prof indemity insurer decided to pull out of the market needed to look elsewhere, also wanted some professional support. ICPA have provided both (PII included in membership fee).
Interested
I would be interested to know if all other practising AAT members do not call themselves 'accountants'. Please tell.
It seems crazy for AAT to prohibit it when everyone else (without qualifications, experience or both) can.
AAT qualified can can themselves accountants.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_of_Accounting_Technicians
I'm an FMAAT
and I use the term accountant, I am also ICPA and find the latter very helpful, and amazing value for money. Tony Margartelli is a pure gem.
FMAAT Accountant here
I've called myself an accountant since I started doing accountanty things. That was before I was a MAAT (something to do with illness delaying full qualification but all exams passed).
Just call yourself an accountant! That's what all the rest of us do!
Most mortgage lenders accept AAT - not sure they do with ICPA?
.
Is the OP perceiving a problem that doesn't exist?
I think so!
I think so too!
If a plumber armed with a calculator can call himself an accountant, I don't think an AAT qualified would have a problem doing so.
Plumb Crazy?
If a plumber armed with a calculator can call himself an accountant, I don't think an AAT qualified would have a problem doing so.
Is not the ICPA a trade association for plumbers armed with calculators calling themselves accountants?
I can see where the OP is coming from... I believe he wants to hold himself (and his practice) out as qualified accountants.The ACCA won't grant him a practice certificate - indeed, would probably black-ball his membership for practising without holding a licence from a body that they, the ACCA, might recognise. I cannot imagine the ACCA being very impressed by a practising certificate from the Independent Certified Plumbing Accountants.
Nomenclature
If a plumber armed with a calculator can call himself an accountant, I don't think an AAT qualified would have a problem doing so.
On the AAT's website there is a "Find an Accountant" link, so it seems that the Association of Accounting Technicians actively promote their members as "accountants".
Footnote: That seems to me something of a misnomer: I suspect most people understand the term "technician" to mean a technically skilled artisan or assistant. For example, one might instantly appreciate the functionary distinctions between a pharmacy technician and a fully-blown pharmacist; or a laboratory technician and the scientists they assist. And how many of us would let a dental technician loose on our teeth in place of a dentist? So long as the AAT call their organisaton accounting "technicians" then I believe Joe Public's perception of a technician will prevail over that of an "accountant".
Joe Public
If a plumber armed with a calculator can call himself an accountant, I don't think an AAT qualified would have a problem doing so.
On the AAT's website there is a "Find an Accountant" link, so it seems that the Association of Accounting Technicians actively promote their members as "accountants".
Footnote: That seems to me something of a misnomer: I suspect most people understand the term "technician" to mean a technically skilled artisan or assistant. For example, one might instantly appreciate the functionary distinctions between a pharmacy technician and a fully-blown pharmacist; or a laboratory technician and the scientists they assist. And how many of us would let a dental technician loose on our teeth in place of a dentist? So long as the AAT call their organisaton accounting "technicians" then I believe Joe Public's perception of a technician will prevail over that of an "accountant".
That find an accountant link was something I was pleased to see appear after I complained that they really didn't show off what we can do in practice on their website. Not all me of course but I like to think I helped to get it there!
Also, while yes technically "technician" is still the name of the accounting body a) How on earth are they going to change the name now? I can't see it happening and b) I call myself an accountant and no-one bats an eyelid. Joe Public calls my firm looking for accountants. I don't think anyone has ever asked what an "accounting technician" is. Which is a relief.
Plumbers
I wish I was a plumber (with or without a calculator) though I did replace the sealant in my shower quite successfully. I'm sure my ICPA subs provided me with that expertise...
I qualified with ACCA but gave them up because all they did for me was make me poorer each year. ICPA actually gives me something (a lot) for my annual subs).
Not quite
You need to have 5 yrs practice experience (and no prior PII claims) to join the ICPA, but I suppose a plumber turned accountant could join after 5 yrs.
ICPA
I can see what ICPA does for its members. The benefits look very impressive and when my institute's email arrives asking for the annual subscription I am sometimes tempted to jump ship.
My concern is, what does ICPA do for the buyers of accountancy and tax services?
My belief is that it creates further confusion in an already confused market-place because it houses the full range of zero to the fully qualified and zero to the highly experienced practitioners. There is no quality benchmark when the buyer might expect one. Caveat emptor just isn't good enough.
Edit. Sorry Shirley, just seen your post. Have the entry requirements recently changed?
Flash Cleans Baths Without Scratching
I wish I was a plumber (with or without a calculator) though I did replace the sealant in my shower quite successfully.
Congratulations! You may now call yourself a plumber.
I qualified with ACCA but gave them up because all they did for me was make me poorer each year. ICPA actually gives me something (a lot) for my annual subs).
Although that worked for you, I inferred that the OP does not want to give up his ACCA status.
You need to have 5 yrs practice experience (and no prior PII claims) to join the ICPA, but I suppose a plumber turned accountant could join after 5 yrs.
My point exactly, Shirley.
Andy
I may be wrong, but I thought you needed 5 yrs practice experience, unless you were qualified. I suppose it's one way of qualifying the unqualified ... maybe?
If a client complains to them (same as with any professional body), they look at the situation, listen to both sides, and then make recommendations.
Shortly after joining the ICPA I had a disgruntled client make a complaint to them. The client gave me the wrong information for their accounts/tax return, then when I talked him through the accounts/tax, he said it was wrong (the wrong info was given to me!), but I had already prepared the accounts/tax. I asked for a token payment of £25 to amend the accounts/tax but they didn't want to pay. The guy was a PITA, and was quite aggressive, so I wouldn't give him an inch. The guy made a formal complaint to the ICPA. The ICPA backed me up, and said my actions had been reasonable.
Abide by Me
I asked for a token payment of £25 to amend the accounts/tax but they didn't want to pay. The guy was a PITA, and was quite aggressive, so I wouldn't give him an inch. The guy made a formal complaint to the ICPA. The ICPA backed me up, and said my actions had been reasonable.
So did he pay up the £25?
yes, and no.
I asked for a token payment of £25 to amend the accounts/tax but they didn't want to pay. The guy was a PITA, and was quite aggressive, so I wouldn't give him an inch. The guy made a formal complaint to the ICPA. The ICPA backed me up, and said my actions had been reasonable.
So did he pay up the £25?
He would have paid (when the ICPA rejected his complaint), but I decided he was too aggressive and I refused to do any further business with him. I had already been paid for the accounts/SA and I really don't want 'bully boys' as clients. I prefer to let some other mug have them as a client. :)
Flash Cleans Baths Without Scratching
Not entirely true alas. I did try hoovering something out of the bath and ended up putting a dirty black scratch along the bottom with the hoover nozzle.....
What does ACCA do for buyers of accountancy and tax services?? Or any of the institutes? Qualifications don't mean the individual is capable as I'm sure many of us have discovered on handovers. Maybe they respond to complaints (spurious or otherwise) by offering up their members as sacrificial lambs and finding for the client, I don't know but I wouldn't be surprised. But otherwise......
Plumbers
Joe Public often calls me asking me to come and unblock their sink with my calculator.... I try and explain that I'm pretending to be an accountant now but they don't listen...
Funnily Enough
I got a flyer through the door offering a few week course to train to be a plumber, with the headline. "Train to be Plumber, Plumbing is the new accountancy and earn £70k per year. I actually have a plumber client who only services boilers (I have a few mates that do that also but that's another story). He has 1200 customers charges £60 + any parts or additional repairs each takes about 30 minutes per job. Earns £50k to £60K profit per year. He is back in the house by 2 every day. Is possibly the happiest bloke I know. Maybe plumbing is the new accountancy.
Plumbers
There maybe something in it. Some years ago I came across a qualified accountant (40 +) who was working in the state sector at a police training establishment.
He was taking a plumbing course at a cost of several thousands.
Result
Thank you all for your comments, you have been really helpful in making up my mind. :)
You're quitting accountancy to become a plumber aren't you?! In that case join ICPA!!
I am an electrician, too :)
Well ... nearly!
I have a C&G (distinction level, no less!) in electronic servicing.
For the non-believers ... I still have the certificate, which is available for inspection. :)