Who rates Sage?

Who rates Sage?

Didn't find your answer?

Can I ask if there is anyone out there who is satisfied with Sage? Who is satisfied with rip-off support costs, the additional work required, the cost of additional software such as Crystal or invoicing software?

Am I alone in thinking Sage is nothing but a rip-off?
David McCarlie

Replies (21)

Please login or register to join the discussion.

aw_logo_2019
By Accounting WEB
04th Jul 2001 10:26

Horses for courses
I believe Sage meets the needs of customers requiring basic finance functions, but the business system functionality is a more complex area. Every business is different even if in the same market.

The ideal solution is an in-house product but this brings its own problems i.e. making sure it has been documented fully so that support can be carried out. I have met so many businesses who have in-house systems, and also complex spreadsheet applications, where the author is no longer around causing horrendous problems.

There is more choice in the market from smaller companies who are better able to respond to customer requirements and develop the functionality required. In common with one of your other responders, I work for a software developer. We can offer a fully integrated finance and human resource system that includes job costing. The system is modular, which means that users purchase the functionality they need.

However we are not competitors of the cheaper Sage products - probably more towards the Sage Line 50/100 end of the market.

I would be pleased to hear from you if you require further information.

Yvonne Buckland
[email protected]

Thanks (0)
aw_logo_2019
By Accounting WEB
03rd Jul 2001 22:38

Sage should send us all a free copy of their software!

Considering the fact that we are all taking keen interest in Sage products, I seriously think Sage should send us all a copy their latest Sage Financial controller, Sage Payroll, FAPP and something called Sage Accounting Production Package. This is the only way to convince everybody that Sage is the best package on this planet. I get free Microsoft products as a beta tester and I don't see why I can't get Sage Products?

Jay Tanna

Thanks (0)
aw_logo_2019
By Accounting WEB
02nd Jul 2001 17:32

Mr Tax's comments
Re Nigel - True

Thanks (0)
aw_logo_2019
By Accounting WEB
03rd Jul 2001 11:27

question response
Dear Charles,

Sorry to hear of your woefull tale with Sage, particularly with the job costing angle!!

Ptarmigan Ltd develop, install, maintain and support and TRUE Windows based software that covers accounting, Payroll ordering etc, but also it has a TOTALLY integrated Job Costing module, which for the small to medium size business, is fantastic (I know you would expect us to say it, but it really is good).

Why dont you give me a call and I'll bre happy to tel you more about it, and how it out performs our competitors ny miles!!!

Regards

Tim Seaton
Director
01954-206150

Thanks (0)
avatar
By User deleted
02nd Jul 2001 14:21

Simple Fact
Sage rate Sage.

Thanks (0)
aw_logo_2019
By Accounting WEB
02nd Jul 2001 11:21

Mr Tax's Comments
An inspection of the performance of the SAGE plc share price over the past 12 months gives a very good indicator of the state of the company

Thanks (0)
avatar
By cbales
30th Jun 2001 16:21

To Tony Reeve
I'm well aware of the sort of mess that an inexperienced person can get into using Sage and have had to sort out the end results on many occasions and for other software also.

That's just the point, inexperienced people who don't want to learn double entry book-keeping shouldn't have to in order to produce reasonable results and QuickBooks has been designed from the ground up for such users.

I'd far rather have client's who can get things right because they can understand it as it has a relatively short learning curve. Of course its not perfect and many accountants don't like it because it doesn't fit the bill as perfectly debit and credit based. It does a pretty good job in operating in the way that is understandable by those without any previous computerised accounting system experience because it works in logical procedures. How many times have you had to explain to a client that their bank statement is the "wrong way around" for debit and credit purposes - QuickBooks just shows a layout that is similar to the bank statement instead and deals with the conversion in the background.

As for Quicken, would you rather have a pile of grubby paper together with a bundle of bank statements and cheque stubbs or a balanced bank account with analysed income and expenditure as a starting basis. It doesn't prepare accounts but it does provide an invoicing system and can deal with VAT matters. No purpose as an accounting tool? If that's all the client needs and wants why should accountants try and foist a "better" system on them - better for whom when its not properly kept!

Thanks (0)
avatar
By Albasas
30th Jun 2001 16:50

Sage Dominant But Not Necessarily Best
Nigel below, you are spot on with the Ford car analogy. Only driving Sage is a problem if you can't afford the training investment.

For me Sage is over complicated and expensive over Quickbooks, But Quickbooks upgrades require improving especially to the phased out V.6 and payroll,and Quicken is a domestic housekeeping finance tool with its uses but not in the commercial world of accountancy.

See last Wednesday's Workshop here through Community above for an insight into Sage's corporate bods at work.

Also many small businesses refuse to upgrade their computer equipment to reach any softwares recommended specifications. Another source of operating problems.

Thanks (0)
aw_logo_2019
By Accounting WEB
30th Jun 2001 19:38

We seem to be paranoid abour SAGE

It seems that we are treating SAGE like Microsoft!. We use their products but we want them brocken down into pieces so that their competitors has got some chance to catch up. I don't think this is good for the consumers and indeed that is not the way to go about. Competitors have to be better to succeed on equal terms. they can't have unfair advantage by destroying successful companies.

I remember I used to buy WordPerfect for DOS for £250, and Lotus 123 for DOS for £350 all single user licenses. These products had copy protection so that if you installed on one machine you can't install it on another!

Then came Microsoft with its Excel and Word for DOS. The price £89 competitive upgrade with no copy protection and free downloads for templates and support files such as printer drivers etc. This revolutionised the way computers are being used. More and more people started using the computers and life became more enjoyable! Absenteesm in my ofice was reduced dramatically and people started coming early/on time to work so that they can meet the deadlines!.

Sage is cheap and in my opinion easy to use. The competitors' products are rarely upgraded and their products are expensive and most probably difficult to use. Name me one Accounting package which sells for £75! You can buy Instant Sage for £75!.

Sage has recently been upgraded. I use version 7 which has improved ODBC for Microsoft family products. This is what we need.

Jay Tanna


Thanks (0)
aw_logo_2019
By Accounting WEB
02nd Jul 2001 08:14

Horses for Courses
I've seen many comments before about Sage and its competitors. Too many people in my opinion base their views on whether particular product does exactly what they want.

All the products vary to some degree and do some things better than others. You cannot expect any off the shelf package to be tailored to an idividuals exact requirements in all circumstances.

I have a client who was quoted £14,000 to £20,000 to get a particular system for a garage written. This was not a whole package but just to deal with vehicle sales.

I for one do not accept Tas or Quickbooks or MYOB are any better or worse than Sage. Tas is nearly the same price as Sage once you get up to needing stock control etc. Some of them restrict the number of support calls you can make in a year etc. Some don't have numbered nominal codes. Sage V7 has easy data transfer but I would agree earlier versions were difficult.

The points about fords and telephone systems are well made and I would like more people to go and get quotes for tailor written software and see what they can get for £750 or so. Perhaps then they would appreciate the value of what you get. It is true as has been said that there is a reluctance to invest in software and proper installation and training. In my experience in a lot of snaller businesses etc the accounting function gets "dumped" on someone, usally the one person who has any computer knowledge at all and who probably has little idea of what is required or how to do it.

You wouldn't buy a £10,000 hi fi system and put 5 watt speakers on it would you.

Thanks (0)
avatar
By cbales
29th Jun 2001 16:24

Heidi
I've met a number of well satisfied QuickBooks operators who were previously Sage users. They are "convertees" because they like the fact that they did not need to know anything about double entry book-keeping to be able to learn and use QuickBooks. The double entry bit is done in the background whilst the operator just gets on with the job of loading the information. A lot of well thought out and developed software is provided for the budget price.

The integration with Excel in the Pro version is a very neat feature. Click on the "Excel" button in any of the reports, select either new workbook or identify an existing workbook and Excel is both started and data transferred across automatically. Great basis for David Carter to start work with pivot tables.

If you've not tried it for yourself Heidi, get a demo and have a look at it. Software support is now in Canada on 0800 numbers and waiting times appear to have been reduced as a result.

Thanks (0)
aw_logo_2019
By Accounting WEB
30th Jun 2001 10:10

Sage
Wow, I never expected such a response to this issue and the wide range of comments is most interesting. To clarify one point, I never said Sage Support was £150, in fact I didn't put a price on support at all. However, one Client I know is paying £2,500 per year which seems very excessive if the package is supposed to be robust. In fact, support calls are mainly connected with data problems and corruption.

Has anyone tried to export an aged debtors summary from Sage to Excel? Easy if you have Crystal but not so easy if you don't. As for Sage payroll, ever tried to re-print a payslip from a previous period?

I've experience of many packages and the best was an in-house written package. My next best is TAS, and given my wide experience of using accounting software, I wouldn't be saying that unless I was very impressed. Transfer of any data to excel is a single click of the mouse, integrity is excellent, corrections, on the very rare occasions it is required, is very straight forward. TAS Payroll, although I had a reluctance to move from Sage Payroll, proved to be an excellent package, easy to use, excellent reports and easy export to Excel.

Sage is only in the small to medium business size market and they have done a very good job of capturing a large percentage of that market with a, in my opinion, very poor product. However, I have to congratulate them on their marketing.

With the acquisition of TAS, Sage have an excellent opportunity to integrate the TAS technology into their own products and it will be interesting to see what develops here.

Going back to my comments on the in-house system. Written by programmers after very careful consultation with accountants. I'm sure we all have our own ideas on what we want accounting software to do and this was an opportunity to produce that.

It seems a pity that accountants don't get together to produce the ultimate accounting package.

Thanks (0)
avatar
By User deleted
29th Jun 2001 15:40

Alternatives to Sage
I have experienced the same issues with Sage as everyone else but are the alternatives really any better? - Is Intuit a better solution?

Thanks (0)
aw_logo_2019
By Accounting WEB
29th Jun 2001 13:35

We are resellers
I agree totally the annual support costs and updates are outrageous. The main problem is when there seems to be so many new releases, its hard enough selling the package as we do in the first place with the high costs but then a few weeks later they bring out another new version and want to charge you for the update.

Thanks (0)
avatar
By dclark
29th Jun 2001 13:50

Comfort zone
Most users are 'happy' because it does most of what they want and their Accountant probably sold it to them or can 'support' it. It meets their comfort zone requirements

Users who require 'extra' functions can move elsewhere - multi currency, sql networking, real time despatch notes, 32bit, internal reporting, etc

The challenge for most implementors is that many clients would rather spend £300 a month on a lease car, but would not spend sufficient on their prime business system ensuring it was on decent machines and the software was set-up correctly and was available for their business.

Obviously it is horses for courses and noone can deny Sage have not done a good job gaining market share...and you don't do that with a crap product.....you do it with a product and a service that 'meets that comfort zone'

As for £150 for unlimited support. That sounds a pretty good deal

Anybody wishing to look at alternatives, please contact us. All are at least multi currency, multi company, networkable products...all strong on stock, SOP, POP

Pastel, Encore, Office2

Regards

Daniel Clark
Ryba Macaulay Ltd
[email protected]

Thanks (0)
avatar
By adam.arca
29th Jun 2001 13:54

Sage is over-rated
I use Sage fairly extensively as a number (far too many!) of my clients use it.

I have to agree with previous comments that it is both overpriced and under-functionalised (is that a word?). I think Line 50 Windows in particular is very poor: if that's the best Sage can do, then they should go back to the DOS version!

Unfortunately, Sage market on the fact that they are the one household name in the SME software market. What is disappointing, however, are the number of accountants who recommend Sage, presumably because it is the "safe" option and presumably because they are unaware of the far superior Quickbooks and TAS Books (my own favourite: will SAge allow this to survive in the long term?)

Thanks (0)
avatar
By AnonymousUser
29th Jun 2001 11:10

try Quickbooks
I used Sage Line 50 and other Sage packages for many years. I was then introduced to Quickbooks and found that it is far easier to amend errors and to export reports to Excel than Sage. I have introduced Quickbooks to 10 different businesses and have had no complaint particularly as price wise it is far better than Sage.

My present employer uses SAGE 50 but we are starting the new financial year on 1st July with Quickbooks.

Thanks (0)
avatar
By neileg
29th Jun 2001 09:14

Like a Ford Escort
For years the Ford Escort was the best selling car in the UK, but it was a lousy vehicle. But everyone could get in one and drive it, and every mechanic knew how to fix it. I think Sage is like that.

I can recall buying Sage Accounts to run under CP/M (remember that?)in 1984 when Sage was two men and a boy. Since then I've dealt with all the various permutations up to and including Line 100. Some of the irritations I had in 1984 are still there!

How much do you think you should pay for your accounting software? I think the problem is that all accounts programs (perhaps with a few exceptions!) are too cheap and have too little spent on testing and development, for the importance they play in their users business. I've known people spend 2-3k on a duff telephone system, and then blanche at 450 for an accounts sytem.

Thanks (0)
aw_logo_2019
By Accounting WEB
29th Jun 2001 09:39

Sage accounts
I have dealt with Sage Line 50 for more years than I care to remember, I've used it in industry, in practice, for my own accounts, client's accounts and written training courses for it. So I shouldn't knock it too much as I have made part of my living out of it for a long time. In general it functions out of the box and does what it says it will do in terms of functionality. I have found it reasonably stable and less prone to falling over than some other packages. So for a low risk strategy it is a good option for the small to medium size business.

Fundementally it has a few problems.
- It's functionality is limited and the technology is old. There are Windows products about with far more functionality and flexibility.
- drill down is awful and trying to trace transactions a nightmare.
- It is single currency, which is a major drawback today and the principle reason that I am migrating certain clients away from it.
- It has it's problems with response times and the indexing on all but small networks. You have to constantly compress the database to keep it working efficiently.
- It's expensive, certainly in it's network form, compared to other packages.

With regard to support I have always found their support staff certainly as good as any other software support I have dealt with. I'm not sure what David McCarlie expects by support, but I could not provide unlimited support for about £150 pa.

Thanks (0)
aw_logo_2019
By Accounting WEB
28th Jun 2001 22:26

I agree with Simon Wray

Sage software may not be the perfect software but with a little bit of twisting and tuning you get what you want from it.

I remeber in 1998, a company which shall remain nameless, spent about £350,000 on Scala Multi-currency software hosted on windows NT and dated BTRIEVE database system. The project failed and the Financial controller lost his job with it.

Then cam yours sincerely on the scene and implemented the entire project on Sage Line 100 ( in just 6 weeks it was a major project for me in terms of revenue!) and the FD gave me a cheque for £10,000 bonus on top of my usual fee for saving his skin. The shareholders were not happy with the information coming out late every month! They used to spent 2 weeks a month just collating the figures!

You need interest in IT to make Sage a success story. I have always been facinated by new technology and my firm considers me their IT guru! They can come to me for any questions whether it be accountancy, tax, law or IT.

So you have it lock stock and ........... (oh! this is a public site and children are reading this before the 9 O' clock watershed!)

Best regards,

Jay Tanna

Thanks (0)
avatar
By [email protected]
02nd Feb 2013 10:42

ANTI SAGE LEAGUE

I think we should conspire to form an ANTI SAGE LEAGUE

Personally I use excel for the majority of my work and Moneysoft provide an excellent payroll software package.

 

My issue with SAGE is that it is far too expensive, although most of my clients use it.  I have no problem with the applications.

 

P.S.  Does anyone fancy joining the Anti Quicken League also?  If you have any clients using this software, then let me express my condolences .. .

Thanks (0)