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ooooooooo
this is a nasty one that could hurt many companies.
Again one sided. Perhaps if, at appeal, instances of CIS refunds of Ltd co's being delayed by years due to "minor" discrepancies, were brought to the Tribunals attention, then they might look at it in "fact" not in "compliance"
"Picking" of the facts
What you fail to mention, is that the company was informed as far back as 2009 that due to late payment of PAYE their registration was cancelled. They appealed and won, keeping their registration - being told that the rules would be applied strictly in the future.
However, the company made no effort to improve payment times, and again in 2010 were informed their registration would be cancelled. They appealed and won yet again.
The company had 2 years worth of warnings and yet failed to take heed.
This is really
getting interesting. Surely if Whitter won the two previous appeals HMRC shouldn't even have thought about taking their gross status away let alone appealing to 2nd tier. Obviously something has changed. Even so HMRC should not be allowed to get away with not paying CIS refunds to Ltd Co's immediately after 6th April as sole traders are. The first tier tribunal take this "fact" into account so why not the 2nd. tier?.
Taking the pi*s?
So apparently this company was flouting the rules for years, we're challenged and got away with it twice but the third time was unlucky. No doubt they had many warnings before the first attempt to cancel. I've absolutely no sympathy for them.
Hmrc is in chaos and things seem to be getting worse but their failings don't excuse ours
If you can't
pay your bills on time, it could be for a number of reasons. The most time outstanding was 40 days. I don't call that non-compliant. I disagree. HMRC failings, especially in CIS does excuse ours. How many companies are still waiting for their refunds years down the line. Compare that to 40 days.
Let's expand a bit. CIS tax owing to Ltd company. Corporation tax owed by company. Along comes HMRC and takes money direct from account to cover CT. Don't tell me this won't happen cos we all know it will.
40 days is late
Most people in this country pay the right amount of tax on time. This company didn't.
I agree with John Jenkins - Did the punishment fit the crime ? I don't believe so. We can all quote examples of CIS not being refunded to Companies not just for several years, but in some cases NEVER. 40 days is late - who amongst us hasn't got Debtors exceeding 40 days by some considerable time ? Should we be seeking to remove livelihoods of those Debtors ? George Orwell is being proved right, yet again. With HMRC powers being increased significantly year on year - perhaps it is time for the whole country to give up and go on benefits !!
Punishment must fit the 'crime'
The company was warned and still didn't comply so they deserved to be sanctioned but the punishent must surely fit the crime. Is this not the corporate equivalent of hanging somebody for stealing loaf of bread? Fine the company, fine them an amount proportionate to the tax compliance failure but do not impose a sanction that kills a viable business and puts people out of work for no good reason. The law needs changing.
The construction
Industry is the only Industry that is penalised in this way - ludicrous.
If I was the judge...
This happened in 2010/11...have they been good since?
If yes keep it if no lose it
Total non compliance seems to be the answer. they don't enforce that at all even when they are told.
There is widescale non compliance with the deductions of CIS and or the associated paperwork.
Not seen anyone caught yet.
No good expecting HMRC to live in the real world of late payment and juggling just to pay your tax so they can waste it.
Plenty of criminals not paying tax and committing fraud but nothing is ever done.
HMRC are clearly charged with the decline of UK plc as a policy decision.
When he couldn't pay his bill he should have prepacked the company and not paid HMRC at all.