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Permit me to disagree
“It’s got to be the time for people to move away from Excel for final accounts production. Producing accounts with a spreadsheet is so inefficient. I appreciate that people want to customise things and are already familiar with Excel, but it’s not an ideal tool for doing this.”
Well that depends on your view of efficiency, and Mr Forbes has an axe to grind in this.
Larger firms where numerous people contribute to a case obviously do benefit from a high-end system that does everything, but for one-man bands like me, it is less efficient to be a slave to a system. Why would it be any more efficient for me to key the data into his system, then submit it, than to key the data into a form from the HMRC/Companies House websites? How many Thousands do his and other systems cost compared to the £Nil I am paying now?
For me, the ideal system obtained for a year or two - an excellent pdf-based Balance Sheet system run by Companies House and a quick to fill in CT600 run by HMRC to which pdf attachments could be added (including the aforesaid Companies House document and pdfs 'printed' from Excel).
Then HMRC fouled everything up with their 'upgrade' to the CT600 which is so bad I have gone back to paper submissions for the duration.
I don't know what I will do after next April if HMRC do not get their act together. One option will be to not submit any CT600s until Autumn 2011 in the hope that sense prevails by then.
No axes to grind
I agree it is difficult to compete with "free", but our accounts software is £335 for unlimited accounts and so not thousands of pounds. The HMRC software is free to you, but of course has been paid for by someone and not a trivial amount either. You may feel it is correct for the HMRC to provide subsidised software, but that is a separate issue.
Most people don't rekey data into our software, they bring it in from a TB in excel or import it from bookkeeping software. I am a big fan of excel but I am not sure about people producing their own accounts in it.
If people really really want to start tagging up their accounts in excel so that they can be transmitted as xbrl I have started jotting down some notes as www.tax.co.uk/products/excelxbrl.htm but as I say it I think this would be a large undertaking.
Who pays for HMRC software?
The "someone" who does is us as taxpayers, but let us not lose sight of the efficiencies that arise to the taxpayer of online filing. They have prematurely axed my local (Bournemouth) Corporation and moved the work to Brighton where the poor buggers are having to key in my paper-based Returns. So I take the view that HMRC makes a net saving from this process.
Besides, what about the little guys? If you are a lay person running a club, society, flat management company etc., who has the right to make you employ an accountant or buy software for one-off use?
Going back to efficiency, I would happily enter a race between my Excel-based accounts preparation and anyone with a 'system'. By the way I think I am among the more advanced practitioners in this matter. Many still type the Accounts out in Word!
Competitive accounts production challenge
I like the sound of this. AccountingWeb could draw up the rules - but it is probably too late to get it into the 2012 Olympics.
There could be individual events and then the triathalon - prepare accounts, send to CH, complete CT return.
Open to individuals and each vendor could put forward its champion.
I am already starting my training ! Where can I get a carbon fibre competition mouse from ?
There's more to accounts than an abbreviated balance sheet and C
"For me, the ideal system obtained for a year or two - an excellent pdf-based Balance Sheet system run by Companies House and a quick to fill in CT600 run by HMRC to which pdf attachments could be added (including the aforesaid Companies House document and pdfs 'printed' from Excel)."
David
What about the full accounts needed by HMRC and the tax computations?
a fascnating couple of hours at Chelsea
a wide range of solutions were being touted about
i need to do a little bit more research but will post my findings later
i saw John Stoydyk out of the corned of my eye but he had fled before i could buttonhole him... wise man