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Basic PAYE Tools - continuing after loss of data

BPT - how to carry on with payroll submissions after loss of data mid-tax year

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I act for a small husband and wife ltd co. Wife had previously taken care of all book-keeping requirements, but has recently died of cancer. She did have a back-up system, but only on the company laptop, which crashed the day before she died, and all data is now lost. I 'phoned HMRC to establish best way to move forward, and have set up their payroll records on my BPT system now, ready to continue monthly submissions. However, HMRC said that I must enter the correct Works/payroll ID's on my version of their BPT, otherwise my submissions will create a duplicate employment record for them. I only act for 5 other similar client companies on my version of BPT, and never make an entry in this box. I don't deal with any payroll that requires any deductions, so not familiar with all the FPS/EPS terminology.  HMRC said they would send me their print-outs, which will have this ID on them, but I'm still waiting 6 weeks+ later. Am also having a similar problem with another client, HMRC having sent incorrect/insufficient payroll info initially, so now waiting another 6 weeks on that one. Thought I would therefore ask on this forum, just in case I have been mis-informed. It would be so much easier if I could just start making monthly submissions after the last one I know was submitted by my late client, and leave the payroll ID boxes blank. Does anyone have any insight into whether this will create a problem....i.e. do I definitely need to ensure that the payroll ID details match? (Obviously, all the other details like DOB, NI number etc. are already entered for both employees.)

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By Matrix
19th Nov 2019 19:40

Sorry to hear this. Just get them submitted with the payroll id blank, it may not have been used anyway. In the event there is a duplicate employment I am sure you can call up and get it removed.

Are there any other employees?

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Replying to Matrix:
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By gouldltd
19th Nov 2019 19:45

No, just the 2 of them, and now only 1.

Thank you - I think that may be the most efficient way of dealing with it....I just wanted to see if anyone replied saying definitely don't do that!

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By penelope pitstop
20th Nov 2019 02:33

Basic PAYE Tools is without doubt the single most abhorrent piece of tax software I have ever come across in my working life.

It never ceases to amaze me how much of a working day one can spend sorting out the most trivial of PAYE problems.

I absolutely abhor it.

I really feel for you.

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By Payrollgal
20th Nov 2019 08:54

You do need to match the payroll ID numbers to avoid duplicates, however, matched ID's don't always prevent duplicates.

Do you have any idea what software the wife was using before? If you do, and you can be confident they were either the first 2 employees on the payroll records or the only then you could phone the software company and find out the default numbers ie, sage is 1, quickbooks is 001 etc. It's unlikely they were changed.

But to be honest, if in your situation, I would leave blank and if there are duplicate records raised, deal with it as and when it happens.

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RLI
By lionofludesch
20th Nov 2019 09:13

Now is the time to be trialling other payroll software in preparation for 2020/21. There's even free stuff out there for businesses with limited numbers of employees.

Turning to your current predicament, I think you're in a bit of a hole as you're fumbling around in the dark. You're just going to have to recreate the recirds as best you can and, if HMRC duplicae some employees, deal with it as it arises. It takes time to get HMRC to make the changes you want but it can be done.

I think you have few options. Possibly just one.

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By Steven Tucker
22nd Nov 2019 12:53

There is a way to complete the RTI submission that indicates the previous Payroll ID isn't known. Our software supports it but I don't know if it is possible to do this using Basic PAYE Tools.

You should give a new Payroll ID, indicate that the payroll ID has changed but leave the previous Payroll ID field as blank. We learned of this procedure orally from HMRC in 2014.

There is very limited written guidance in the Data items guide, where for field 40 (Old Payroll ID for this employment) it says, "In a very few limited circumstances the Old Payroll ID may not be obtainable. In those circumstances only omit this field."
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploa...

There's also this page, which is rather vague:
https://www.gov.uk/payroll-software/if-you-change-software

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Replying to Steven Tucker:
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By gouldltd
22nd Nov 2019 13:03

OK, thank you very much. I will look at those links before I make my submissions.

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Replying to gouldltd:
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By Matrix
22nd Nov 2019 21:52

You are completely overthinking this. There is one Director on the payroll and you are probably his tax agent. If anything goes wrong you can call up and get a duplicate employment removed.

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