Client does not have 3 years of self assessment

What about those who left employment and started off as sole trader

Didn't find your answer?

I appreciate you can not cover everyone, but these people are not one who are choosing a tax avoidance scheme. 

I think at the moment it is they are one of those who are the unfortunate but just wanted that confirmed and see if HMRC could make a discretion. Many people had full time employment and then left their jobs to start contarcting. But left in the past year so no sig self assessment returns.

If the main purpose is to get a fair assessment of the monthly wage, can they not use your employed income for this basis?

Replies (14)

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By paul.benny
27th Mar 2020 11:26

We'll just have to wait until the detail of the scheme is published. Until then, anything else is speculation or wishful thinking.

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Psycho
By Wilson Philips
27th Mar 2020 11:30

Panellist in Question Time last night suggested that those who started post 5 April 19 should send in what they have (bank statements, invoices etc) and they might be covered. But I got the impression that he was just making it up (although that may prove to be the case).

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Replying to Wilson Philips:
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By Adam12345
27th Mar 2020 11:38

I was watching that, he was definitely ‘winging it’.

Only one years tax return is needed, and they will take the average of that. Will use average of last 3 years if available.

No tax returns, then it’s universal credit.

One reason why it isn’t advantageous to claim AIA I guess...

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Replying to Adam12345:
JCACE
By jcace
27th Mar 2020 11:42

Adam12345 wrote:

One reason why it isn’t advantageous to claim AIA I guess...

You will notice that the guidance keeps referring to "trading profit" rather than taxable profit, so I wouldn't be surprised if the impact of CAs is ignored. However, we need to see the definition of "trading profits" to be certain one way or the other.

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Replying to jcace:
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By Adam12345
27th Mar 2020 11:50

Maybe, but that would make a complex process into an extremely complex process.

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Replying to Wilson Philips:
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By Southwestbeancounter
27th Mar 2020 14:29

Yes and the BBC Newscast programme later on in the evening said that the reason the Government had allowed people the next few weeks to get their tax returns in was because the newly self-employed couldn't get them in in January as it was too soon so they were being asked to do it now so that they didn't get left out! Eek! Suffice to say I went mad at the TV, took to Twitter and corrected them. Let's see if they get it right tonight..........

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Replying to Wilson Philips:
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By Comptable
27th Mar 2020 15:51

That was Robert Jenrick - he seemed to be making it all up and answering questions that hadn't been asked but notthe one that had.

Sunak said "..., only those who are already in self-employment, who have a tax return for 2019, will be able to apply"

So the answer is no - which of course might change.

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JCACE
By jcace
27th Mar 2020 11:39

The self-employed scheme covers those who were self-employed in 18/19 and are still self-employed.
"To be eligible for the scheme you must meet all the criteria below:

Be self-employed or a member of partnership;
Have lost trading/partnership trading profits due to COVID-19;
File a tax return for 2018-19 as self-employed or a member of a trading partnership. Those who have not yet filed for 2018-19 will have an additional 4 weeks from this announcement to do so;
Have traded in 2019-20; be currently trading at the point of application (or would be except for COVID 19) and intend to continue to trade in the tax year 2020 to 2021
Have trading profits of less than £50,000 and more than half of your total income come from self-employment. This can be with reference to at least one of the following conditions:
Your trading profits and total income in 2018/19
Your average trading profits and total income across up to the three years between 2016-17, 2017-18, and 2018-19." (Gov guidance)

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By Duggimon
27th Mar 2020 11:42

edit: scuppered by the above

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By Michael Davies
27th Mar 2020 12:00

I know it’s tough ,but those non tax people suggesting payments could be made before June are unrealistic.How are HMRC going to do this ?Has an algorithm been devised,which also picks up bank details or are staff going to have to d/w on a case by case basis.Presumably from my experience of open plan offices,every other HMRC desk must now be left empty.

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Replying to Michael Davies:
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By Not Anonymous
27th Mar 2020 12:11

Michael Davies wrote:

I know it’s tough ,but those non tax people suggesting payments could be made before June are unrealistic.How are HMRC going to do this ?Has an algorithm been devised,which also picks up bank details or are staff going to have to d/w on a case by case basis.Presumably from my experience of open plan offices,every other HMRC desk must now be left empty.

HMRC do already have a PAYE system (for individuals not employers) where they send a refund letter/calculation and invite people to log onto their Personal Tax Account and input their bank account details and the refund is then transferred into your bank account.

Maybe they could use a similar system for this?

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By carnmores
27th Mar 2020 12:11

for those who started s/e in this fiscal year i suggest that they get a tax return in asap after 6th April

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Replying to carnmores:
By Duggimon
27th Mar 2020 12:37

Those who started s/e this fiscal year have been specifically excluded from the measures announced, both by the government yesterday and then earlier in this very thread.

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Replying to Duggimon:
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By Southwestbeancounter
27th Mar 2020 14:33

Southwestbeancounter wrote:

Yes and the BBC Newscast programme later on in the evening said that the reason the Government had allowed people the next few weeks to get their tax returns in was because the newly self-employed couldn't get them in in January as it was too soon so they were being asked to do it now so that they didn't get left out! Eek! Suffice to say I went mad at the TV, took to Twitter and corrected them. Let's see if they get it right tonight..........

Yes, unless you watched Newscast on the BBC last night - see above!

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