Co Director abusing CJRS ?

Ltd Co Director furloughed

Didn't find your answer?

There might have been similar posts in here and contradictory opinions.

The company director, who has been on payroll at £809 / month prior to COVID-19 and his secretary spouse have furloughed themselves and asked me to claim the maximum CJRS for them. I believe this is abuse of the CJRS. 

What is your opinion? What will be the consequenses of his actions? 

 

Replies (10)

Please login or register to join the discussion.

avatar
By Martin Schneider
04th Jun 2020 18:42

If they are not working for the company, aside from fulfilling their legal duties as director etc, I see no reason they couldn't claim the 80% furlough grant?

Unless they are still trading in the business then, as you say, this is an abuse of the system and is fraud. You'd be required to make a SAR to your money laundering supervisory body.

Thanks (0)
Replying to Martin Schneider:
avatar
By mariabob
04th Jun 2020 19:28

Thank you, Martin.

Thanks (0)
RLI
By lionofludesch
04th Jun 2020 18:50

One key point missing from the OP.

Are they working ? Beyond fulfilling their statutory duties.

HMRC have been at pains to confirm that a director is not barred from claiming CJRS merely because he is a director.

Thanks (0)
Replying to lionofludesch:
avatar
By mariabob
04th Jun 2020 19:23

The director has been working but not the spouse - secretary.

Thanks (0)
Replying to mariabob:
.
By Cheshire
04th Jun 2020 19:45

Tell him you cannot claim for him as he is working. You can claim for her, but only at the lower RTI reported at Feb (or pre March 19th) wage rate.

Thanks (0)
Danny Kent
By Viciuno
04th Jun 2020 19:15

I agree with the points above.

However are you saying that your clients have asked you to increase their wages to maxamise their furlough claim? I assume they think this is the 2.5k a month? If so, that is not possible. Their maximum furlough claim is defined on HMRC's CJRS webpage.

It would appear that your client will be entitled to £809*80% a month. Even if they increase their wages to £3,125pm the maximum claim would still be £809*80%.

Thanks (2)
Replying to Viciuno:
avatar
By mariabob
04th Jun 2020 19:26

Thanks, Viciuno.
Yes, they asked me to increase their wages so they can claim and pay themselves £2.5k.

Thanks (0)
Replying to mariabob:
avatar
By Matrix
04th Jun 2020 19:56

Have you read the rules? They can only claim based on Feb pay and provided they are not working.

To be honest, when most accountants have been living and breathing these rules for over two months to support our clients, I am starting to get annoyed with those who can’t work it out for themselves. Please read the furlough threads since 23 March, of which there are many.

Thanks (0)
Replying to mariabob:
RLI
By lionofludesch
04th Jun 2020 23:29

Quote:

Thanks, Viciuno.
Yes, they asked me to increase their wages so they can claim and pay themselves £2.5k.

Oh right. Well, why didn't you say that plainly instead of beating around the bush? We're accountants. We like numbers.

Yes - £648ish for the wife and fa for the husband plus an indication that he'll be looking for a new accountant if he tries to pull something like that again.

HMRC said earlier this week that they'll be checking up on fraud. I'd imagine that resubmitting four month old payrolls would be something that would raise a red flag fairly easily.

Thanks (0)
Replying to Viciuno:
By petersaxton
04th Jun 2020 19:27

HMRC would spot any increase in wages due to the grant.

Thanks (2)