Furlough due to self-isolation

Is it now OK to furlough staff just for a period of self-isolation?

Didn't find your answer?

Sorry if I am late to the party here, I did look but couldn't see any existing posts on this topic.

Have you seen this article? : https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-57515232

Clients are starting to ask about it and I wondered what everyone thought.

Replies (17)

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By paul.benny
22nd Jul 2021 15:19

Guidance here:

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/coronavirus-covid-19-what-to-do-if-youre-emp...

Doesn't say you can't furlough to cover self-isolation; doesn't say you can't.

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By CJaneH
22nd Jul 2021 15:41

Why not. ! They cannot work due to Covid.

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By NYB
22nd Jul 2021 15:48

This from GovUk ( I dealt with one yesterday and this was my response to client)
If your employee is on sick leave or self-isolating as a result of coronavirus, they may be able to get Statutory Sick Pay (SSP). The Coronavirus Job Retention Scheme is not intended for short-term absences from work due to sickness.
Short term illness or self-isolation should not be a consideration when deciding if you should furlough an employee. If, however, employers want to furlough employees for business reasons and they are currently off sick, they are eligible to do so, as with other employees. In these cases, the employee should no longer receive sick pay and would be classified as a furloughed employee.
I responded as follows (its a bit harsh because i know these employees pull the strings)
"This isn’t an easy one. Please read the Gov.Uk rules. It is quite “grey” in your case. Let me point out a few scenarios:
• You could say “well I didn’t have enough work for them anyway so I could Furlough them for those two weeks
• Or you could say “ they would have been working so its only SSP”
Please bear in mind Furlough is not a God given right. Its your choice. It is not your employees place to tell you what they think and what they want. You could have decided in Mar 2020 to lay them all off with no pay at all
Now
Option 1: Comes at a cost to you as an employer. You are picking up 10% now of Furlough.
Option 2: You recoup all the SSP (£96pw approx.) and pay no extra 10% for those two weeks etc so your costs are down as an employer.
Its in your hands.So the answer is really yes you can.

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By Duggimon
22nd Jul 2021 16:17

Quote:
A Treasury spokesperson said: "It has always been clear that the purpose of the furlough scheme is to support jobs - we've been upfront about that from the start.

"The guidance sets out that the scheme is not intended for short-term absences from work due to sickness or self-isolation. We have a specific support package in place for those self-isolating due to coronavirus, including one-off payments for those on low incomes.

"If an employer wants to furlough an employee for business reasons and they are currently off sick then they are eligible to do so as with other employees. This has been set out in guidance since April last year."

That is a very wriggly response that is consistent with the guidance but appears to say it's fine to furlough an employee because they're self isolating when it is not and never has been.

An employee may be furloughed if, due to Coronavirus, there is insufficient work for them to do, or their workplace is shut. Their position is furloughed, not the person. If there's plenty of work but they can't do it, it's sick pay.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/check-which-employees-you-can-put-on-furloug...

The guidance is perfectly clear. An employee who is self isolating or sick can be furloughed only when the employer also has business reasons for doing so.

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Replying to Duggimon:
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By NYB
22nd Jul 2021 16:25

Broadly what I said. One of my clients said they felt it would be morally wrong to furlough.

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Replying to NYB:
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By Hugo Fair
22nd Jul 2021 17:08

Whilst it may be broadly what you said, your message to your client concluded with "Its in your hands. So the answer is really yes you can."
Although that may be semantically correct, it is as potentially misleading as the GOV.UK guidance.

To make Duggimon's point even more forcefully ... the need/decision to furlough is a business decision (not one based on the health of an employee*) and so needs to precede discovery of the individual's self-isolating status. That sequence cannot be reversed.
[* the exception is where the underlying general health of the individual put them on the shielding list - but this status no longer exists].

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Replying to Hugo Fair:
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By NYB
22nd Jul 2021 18:57

I shall tell you this and probably shouldnt so do. I am totally p****** off with some of the clients and their demanding employees re Furlough. They are out for all they can get. And so I've left it up to her in this case. In the unlikely event of an enquiry we could probably stand our corner. A hairdresser with reduced bookings.
And do you know - I bet you I can foresee her decision as she hates paying anthing. So the thought of SSPcoming her way will make her little eyes perk open

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Replying to NYB:
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By Hugo Fair
22nd Jul 2021 21:50

FWIW I wasn't have a dig at you or your earlier response, merely trying to reinforce the 'correct' answer ... which I fully understand may not be what your client wants to hear - and indeed may well go on to ignore.
Don't forget, you can only advise (preferably with a retained copy in your files) ... it is the client who is liable for what they decide to claim (and may later have to repay).

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Replying to Duggimon:
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By PandoraSleeps
22nd Jul 2021 16:58

So, perhaps it would be OK if the employer had to shut down a particular activity or part of their business due to so many staff having to self isolate? As that would have a wider business impact...

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By CJaneH
22nd Jul 2021 17:18

I would point out that the questioner stated the worker was self isolating, not that they were sick. I do not see how the employer can apply SSP for some one who is not sick but obeying the government recommendations!

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Replying to CJaneH:
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By Hugo Fair
22nd Jul 2021 17:42

That's simple ... see https://www.gov.uk/statutory-sick-pay and read the section headed "If you cannot work because of coronavirus (COVID-19)"

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Replying to Hugo Fair:
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By Matrix
23rd Jul 2021 08:09

The employee is entitled to SSP but I don’t see where it says that the employer can get it back.

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Replying to Matrix:
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By Matrix
23rd Jul 2021 08:52

Found it, it now includes self-isolating. I must have been looking at an old version before this became a thing.

https://www.gov.uk/employers-sick-pay

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By the_drookit_dug
22nd Jul 2021 19:36

'for business reasons'

What a hideously vague term.

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By NYB
23rd Jul 2021 16:29

This thread has produced such a lot of comments. Furlough has been going now for 18 months yet still we are strugling with certain issues that are so time consuming. This could be so straightforward if HMRC had come out and said "isolation - SSP". lets face it Isolation is short term - doesnt go on for weeks. Its bad enough that another SSP claim has to be done. Of course when you read articles on all this- written by the legal bods- it is them that have picked up the vagueness on all this to say you CAN claim.
And I agree "for business reasons" couldnt be more vague

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Replying to NYB:
By Duggimon
26th Jul 2021 10:27

It's because, as has been evident through every aspect of the whole 18 months of the pandemic, the government care more about the potential political ramifications of their actions than about doing what's best for the greatest number of people.

Presumably, since it hasn't improved at all in all this time, the guidance is deliberately vague so that when the government are questioned on it, answers can be bent as suits, rather than making it specific so that businesses can read in plain English how the various measures are applied.

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Replying to Duggimon:
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By NYB
26th Jul 2021 12:00

What a good answer.

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