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Gift Aid section of SA return

Is an entry required if no there is no claim for additional relief?

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I have a few higher rate taxpayers who provide full details of payments made under Gift Aid and provide the full details of payments each year.  I have a few who are standard rate taxpayes and provide full details which I always include on their returns even though there is no claim being made.

This year a standard rate client has said that she has paid about £40 in total to a 'couple' of charities under gift aid but has no precise details.  SA100 notes are no help as they make no mention of anything where there will be no additional relief claim. 

I would be inclined to advise her that an entry is not necessary if no claim is being made, but is this correct?

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By Not Anonymous
16th Jan 2020 09:59

Not how I understand it. The return is for you/her to declare amounts paid under the Gift Aid scheme.

If only those who are entitled to "additional relief" included it then any excessive relief would never be paid back.

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RLI
By lionofludesch
16th Jan 2020 10:00

Given that the information you have is vague and the tax effect is zero, I'd be inclined to gloss over these donations.

Standard rate of income tax ? It's been the basic rate for nearly 50 years now.....

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Replying to lionofludesch:
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By Not Anonymous
16th Jan 2020 10:08

lionofludesch wrote:

Given that the information you have is vague and the tax effect is zero, I'd be inclined to gloss over these donations.

Standard rate of income tax ? It's been the basic rate for nearly 50 years now.....

Unless of course the "standard" rate was actually the intermediate rate and a (very small) amount of additional relief was due.

Or only a very small amount of standard rate (whatever that actually is) tax was charged and some claw back of the Gift Aid relief was required.

As ever insufficient facts to know for certain.

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Replying to Not Anonymous:
Woolpit Gus
By nutwood
16th Jan 2020 10:21

Sorry - was dealing with a VAT issue immediately prior to this so 'standard rate' was lodged in my addled brain!
Client has taxable income after allowances of £24k

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Replying to nutwood:
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By Not Anonymous
16th Jan 2020 10:35

nutwood wrote:

Sorry - was dealing with a VAT issue immediately prior to this so 'standard rate' was lodged in my addled brain!
Client has taxable income after allowances of £24k

So even if Scottish resident highest rate will be 20%.

Irrespective of that though it should be included. I think you have imagined something that doesn't exist when it comes to the need for there to be "additional relief".

If this client (assuming not Scottish resident) had an extra pension source or employment with basic rate tax deducted would you leave that off the return?

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Replying to Not Anonymous:
RLI
By lionofludesch
16th Jan 2020 10:53

Not Anonymous wrote:

If this client (assuming not Scottish resident) had an extra pension source or employment with basic rate tax deducted would you leave that off the return?

I might if the taxpayer was so Wavy Mavis about what she'd paid.

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Replying to Not Anonymous:
Woolpit Gus
By nutwood
16th Jan 2020 11:14

The clue I was imagining is that the entries are on page TR4. The page heading is "Tax Reliefs". The first section of the page is for claiming tax relief on pension contributions. The second section on the page is "Charitable Giving" and the third section is "Blind Persons Allowance"
The gift aid section will not accept an entry without the name of the payee being declared. If you've signed gift aid declarations for two or three charities in the year but have lost the paperwork and do not remember exactly what the names of the charities were and the precise amounts then you can't make a claim on your SA return.

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Replying to nutwood:
RLI
By lionofludesch
16th Jan 2020 11:24

nutwood wrote:

The clue I was imagining is that the entries are on page TR4.

Well, that depends. If you don't pay enough tax to cover the Gift Aid, it's not much of a relief.

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Replying to nutwood:
By Duggimon
16th Jan 2020 11:45

nutwood wrote:

The gift aid section will not accept an entry without the name of the payee being declared. If you've signed gift aid declarations for two or three charities in the year but have lost the paperwork and do not remember exactly what the names of the charities were and the precise amounts then you can't make a claim on your SA return.

That just isn't true. I've virtually never filled a tax return with Gift Aid included that didn't just say "per schedule" and had a total for all donations made in the year.

Of course I have the schedules on file if I need them, but almost never put the names of the charities on the return, only occasionally if it's just a single one off donation.

It's not necessarily a better or worse system than putting them all on the return, just thought I'd mention that it would appear to be entirely acceptable to HMRC to not mention the names of the charities on the return. I would still however expect my client to know what they donated and to whom and would retain that information in the event of a query.

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Replying to Duggimon:
RLI
By lionofludesch
16th Jan 2020 12:03

Duggimon wrote:

That just isn't true. I've virtually never filled a tax return with Gift Aid included that didn't just say "per schedule" and had a total for all donations made in the year.

The question is - does HMRC call for the charity's names or is it just your software ?

I suspect the latter.

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Replying to lionofludesch:
Woolpit Gus
By nutwood
16th Jan 2020 13:34

Well, the software (PTP) won't accept no entry in the box but as it obviously doesn't have access to a database of all charities etc. making Gift Aid claims, it will happily accept anything you type in.

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Replying to nutwood:
RLI
By lionofludesch
16th Jan 2020 13:46

nutwood wrote:

Well, the software (PTP) won't accept no entry in the box but as it obviously doesn't have access to a database of all charities etc. making Gift Aid claims, it will happily accept anything you type in.

What does HMRC get ?

Does HMRC software ask for the charity's name ? It's a long time since I used it but I think not. I don't remember typing in every donation line by line back in the dayh.

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the sea otter
By memyself-eye
16th Jan 2020 11:08

Basic rate taxpayer who has donated 'about' forty quid on which no tax relief will be due.
Worth bothering with?

No.

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Replying to memyself-eye:
RLI
By lionofludesch
16th Jan 2020 11:24

memyself-eye wrote:

Basic rate taxpayer who has donated 'about' forty quid on which no tax relief will be due.
Worth bothering with?

No.

Quite.

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By Joe Alderson
17th Jan 2020 09:38

You should at a glance be able to tell if the taxpayers PAYE is sufficient to cover the Charities tax clawback on the Gift Aid. If it's clear that the client has not gifted "too much" and they are a basic rate taxpayer I would probably leave it off. However just putting £40 on will make zero difference anyway, so it's your call really.

If there was a risk that the client might owe tax back because they have gifted too much then you would need to declare it as accurately as possible because it leads to an increase in the clients liability, but otherwise I don't believe there is a legal obligation to make a claim for gift aid relief, especially when the relief isn't available.

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