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Has anyone any advice as to how to deal with 'missing' 64-8s?

Has anyone any advice as to how to deal with ...

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I know I'm not alone with this, so any suggestions as to how to proceed would be welcomed.

I have sent a few 64-8s to HMRC over the last couple of months after taking over from another accountant. HMRC have denied all knowledge of the majority of them (but not all) and suggest we resend (after the embaressment of asking the client to sign again).

What riles me is that they have gone from the old accountants list, so HMRC seem to have half the story. I'm always told the 64-8 depot doesn't have telephones and their staff can't read so we can't write to them (ok, so not the second part, but they have ignored every letter over the years). Should I be making a formal complaint? Will they just say 'we never had them'?

Any suggestions?

Replies (12)

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By Chris Wise
04th Aug 2009 11:23

Take overs and mergers
If you've simply taken over another firm's client list why not speak tot he agent maintainer at your local ofice and as them to change all the old list to your firm's agent reference, its usually top lright (i think) of the screen when you log in to the HMRC website. you may need to put in writing, but you shouldn't need to do new 64-8s for all clients.

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By leon0001
04th Aug 2009 11:57

Extra signature
I always ask new clients to sign 2 forms 64-8 so that I have a spare for when the original disappears into the Longbenton black hole.

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By thomas.peterson
04th Aug 2009 12:14

Perhaps that would have been the best way
But instead they sent out lots of 64-8s. Meh, live and learn.

Having said that I intend to steal your 2 64-8 idea and claim it as my own to the partners :) That would make my life MUCH easier.

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By shaunmcguinness
04th Aug 2009 12:37

They have lost the plot!
I think HMRC have lost the plot when it comes to 64-8's.

I have clients who have disappeared from the website, clients where I have sent in 6 x 64-8's and we still aren't agents and on and on.

We also have the same problem with asking a client to sign another 64-8 and they must think we are daft!

I now get clients to sign at least 3 when we sign them up so we have extra copies - ridiculous I know but what else can we do? I don't blame HMRC staff but their systems!

And now when we sign up new clients for PAYE etc HMRC have just started sending post to an address we haven't used for 4 years! each time we call them to ask them to change they have no record of this "old" address on their systems! Arghhh. Gone bald now with pulling out hair!

Hampshire Accountants
Basingstoke Accountants

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By Warwickshire Accountant
04th Aug 2009 13:19

2 copies
Yeah I go down the route of always getting multiple copies signed when I meet the client, this way I ensure that if (and when) they do go missing I have spares to send in.

The other method I have used with much success is the online authorisation. However when you get clients who don't ever open anything marked HMRC this does cause issues.

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By Anonymous
04th Aug 2009 13:46

I can only imagine what happens is that if the 64-8 factory (and what a dull job!) gets behind they shred them. Similarly if someone daily allocation doesn't get done, they just bin them at the end of the day. Ditto if there is a problem, they refuse to write back to the agent, but just bin them. Which presumably means some agents are sending in copy after copy and coming up with the same problem, but no-one is telling them.

Sheer mess the whole system, and no-one at HMRC seems to have the balls to take them on.

We always use the on-line system. Which is flaky - but does work better.

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By Supotco
04th Aug 2009 14:26

whoever does them can clearly only cope with one in every envelope. I've had lots where I've sent them in for couples and one has been processed and the other not.

On the other hand, I have had some success with sending a copy to the district with a stern letter stating 'the original was sent to HMRC on the NNth of N, 20NN and has not been processed'.

On a third hand (my, that would be useful!) I sent off a very tetchy letter to HMRC the other week, enclosing a replacement 64-8 for someone who had been a client for 15 years and expressing my annoyance that this was necessary. Their reply was basically that back in January they had transferred the record to another adviser but they did not know who, how or why.


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By nogammonsinanundoubledgame
04th Aug 2009 16:54

Online system ...
... still no use if UTR has yet to be issued.
Otherwise not too bad provided that you act fast enough. Keep client informed to expect the code, but warn him that despite its supposed issue date a month before expiry he will probably only receive it a week before expiry.

What is so galling is the HMRC complaint that sending in multiple copies of 64-8 exacerbates the problem.

With kind regards

Clint Westwood

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By Anonymous
05th Aug 2009 10:09

As already mentioned, the online method is usually best. But I still find that an unacceptably high proportion of clients either receive their code after the expiry date or never receive it at all.
Unfortunately it seems that out of a choice of two methods, both are flawed!

Iwan Evans

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By Shorty
05th Aug 2009 12:37

They do answer the phone there...
I have rang Longbenton in the past (0845 915 8582) and they try to help.

2 copies at 1st off is a good idea. At the mo I always send a copy of the original with a 'tetchy' letter suggesting they have lost the 1st one posted and it seems to work.

As suggested previously the online authorisation can work but comes with the aforementioned dates and addresses issues.

Can they sort out this and the refunds saga out soon?!

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By markabacus
05th Aug 2009 13:15

64-8 .v. Online
Personally I've about given up with the on-line, too many times having to request again and again for the letter to be issued to the client. One mth I had 6 issued, 1 arrived at the clients but after 30 days so no use, the others never arrived.

Occasionally I do try again but use 64-8 mainly but not without problems, just less than the on-line method

Any other supplier we wld ditch and go elsewhere but that's not really an option, is it?


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By kevinringer
10th Aug 2009 14:21

Don't do online or use agent maintainer
Because both will only change agent details for SA - not anything else (NI, PAYE, VAT, Tax Credits). If you need to register change of agent for these (which is usually the case) then you have to use a paper 64-8. Also, don't forget FBI2 for online PAYE and CIS.

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