HMRC security changes

Is your operating system up to date for payroll submissions?

Didn't find your answer?

Morning all!

Are you aware that HMRC changed their security settings on 9 May 2024 so that payroll packages running on Windows 8 or 8.1 are no longer able to send RTI submissions? There is no workaround other than to switch to updated versions of Windows (i.e. 10 or 11).

I've received reports of businesses using Moneysoft Payroll Manager having to buy new laptops in order to file their CIS returns as their operating systems were not updated in time. Has anyone else experienced similar with this or any other software?

Thanks!

Replies (14)

Please login or register to join the discussion.

avatar
By paul.benny
28th May 2024 07:49

Windows 8 and 8.1 are more than 10 years old, and support ended more than a year ago.

Why is anyone still using such old versions?

Thanks (6)
Replying to paul.benny:
Universe
By SteveOH
28th May 2024 09:43

Because some of us are dinosaurs haha. I'm still using Widows 7, for heaven's sake and I had this problem as well with filing RTI. I'll have to buy a new laptop.

Now, where's my quill pen!!

Thanks (3)
By JCresswellTax
28th May 2024 10:15

Surely no one is still using Windows 8? Mentalists if so, hardly safe!

Thanks (2)
avatar
By FactChecker
28th May 2024 12:43

I wasn't aware of this specific change/limitation (until I saw the cri de coeurs from Moneysoft users on here last week), as I'm now fully retired so not in the 'daily loop' ... but it should not be a conceptual surprise.

Software keeps being upgraded and that applies not just to the 'packages' that people see/use but to the underlying operating system (e.g. Windows), and indeed rather further down in the unseen mechanics.

HMRC are reasonably good (not a phrase you'll see me use that often) at informing developers of planned changes and/or withdrawal of supported environments and features ... so it is really incumbent on those developers to not only react and adapt within their software, but to inform their clients of what's coming - or rather going!

Not all of the HMRC information is suitable for users without 'translation' from its native techno-speak - per couple of recent examples below - but developers are in a position to put the simple English 'impact' version out there for end-users ... and it's THEIR fault if they can't be bothered to do so!
.

HMRC recent email:
"Following on from our previous communications, we have now completed the update to our live (production) environments, removing support for a number of cipher suites known to be more vulnerable to attack. This was slightly delayed from the intended roll out and the change took place on 9 May 2024.
To ensure that this security change has not impacted your application, we strongly recommend that you test your applications against the relevant services to ensure that your connectivity is not affected. The following live environments no longer accept CBC ciphers:
for Transaction Engine and for API Platform "

Thanks (4)
Replying to FactChecker:
avatar
By neiltonks
28th May 2024 15:10

The earliest communication from HMRC to software developers about this which I can find was early in September last year, so the information has been out there for some time. As you say, HMRC are generally pretty good about keeping us informed of technical changes like this.

Thanks (1)
Replying to FactChecker:
avatar
By JustAnotherUser
29th May 2024 10:45

The first responsibility lies with the business owner, any business no matter how small has an obligation to protect their own, employees and client data.

-The British Data Protection Authority ICO considers operating systems that are no longer supported inadequate security.

Do not think it wont happen to you, update now.

Thanks (1)
Replying to JustAnotherUser:
avatar
By FactChecker
29th May 2024 12:12

True - but not relevant to issue posted by OP or indeed my response.

A 3rd party (HMRC in this case) has decided to stop accepting submissions made via piece of software IF that software is operated on a PC running a specified version of an operating system. No problem with that in itself.
That decision was relayed to the developers of that piece of software well in advance of it being enforced so they could take appropriate actions. That's fine.

My point, and I stick by it, is that the developer has responsibilities to not only make changes if necessary in its software .. but also to inform all users of that software of the impact approaching around the corner.
That should be pure common sense (as well as indicative of paying more than lip service to the concept of customer support and quality services).

Thanks (2)
Replying to FactChecker:
avatar
By JustAnotherUser
29th May 2024 16:04

and my point is that in this timeline every business owner should already be ahead of the curve and no longer be processing any kind of data on these operating systems.
Did you change your user profile from HF?

Thanks (1)
Replying to JustAnotherUser:
avatar
By FactChecker
29th May 2024 18:47

Our two points are not mutually exclusive - indeed both are simultaneously valid.

I'm a known pedant, so I'll only add that I've never changed my user profile here!

Thanks (2)
stonks
By WinterDragon
28th May 2024 13:02

As others have pointed out, I struggle to have sympathy for any business using an operating system that is no longer officially supported and getting regular security updates. I'm sure some IT bros on here can advise the recommended life cycle of office computers is about every 4-6 years. Windows 10 was released in 2015 so they must be using computers purchased at least 8 years ago.

I might have a bit more sympathy when Windows 10 gets sunsetted as the upgrade to windows 11 was a bit awkward with having to mess around with TPM settings in BIOS'. You don't really need expensive computers for accountancy. I think we last fully upgraded our computers in Q4 2020 for around £400 a piece (inc VAT). I looked into upgrades recently and it would be around £200-£250 just to upgrade processor, motherboard and ram to DDR5.

As for the original question I've never experienced this problem as I've always kept our computers updated to modern specs - I have experience the opposite when trying to play older games on modern OS'. Sometimes you have to go digging through forums and downloading all kinds of fixes to try and get a 20 year old game to run on Windows 11.

Thanks (1)
Replying to WinterDragon:
By SteveHa
29th May 2024 09:07

WinterDragon wrote:

As for the original question I've never experienced this problem as I've always kept our computers updated to modern specs - I have experience the opposite when trying to play older games on modern OS'. Sometimes you have to go digging through forums and downloading all kinds of fixes to try and get a 20 year old game to run on Windows 11.

Linux and DOSBox or VirtualBox are your friend :)

Thanks (0)
Tornado
By Tornado
28th May 2024 13:32

I have just checked our operating system and she is fine. Regular cups of tea and buns keep her going all day without any glitches.

On the other hand, we had to have a massive update of three computers a little while back when STEAM became incompatible with Windows 7 and without an upgrade we would not have been able to play our favourite games.

My IT support engineer is two hundred miles away, but was able to upgrade all three computers from Windows 7 to Windows 10 online. (The Computer specs were insufficient to install Windows 11). The process was a bit traumatic with each one taking about 4 hours to complete the upgrade, (mainly due to shortage of memory), but after a lot of re-configuring and customising, all three are working fine.

Windows 7 was utterly reliable and did everything we wanted it to, but now at least we can continue with the games and are ready for any other program changes that rely on Windows 10 or 11. (My new laptop is W11. It is OK but I guess any significant improvements over W10 are in the background, and not that obvious to users)

Thanks (0)
Replying to Tornado:
avatar
By D V Fields
28th May 2024 22:50

[quote=Tornado]

On the other hand, we had to have a massive update of three computers a little while back when STEAM became incompatible with Windows 7 and without an upgrade we would not have been able to play our favourite games.

I trust that includes Robocraft.

Thanks (0)
avatar
By AdamJones82
29th May 2024 19:55

Who used Windows 8 any longer than needed? Masochists!

Thanks (0)