How much do you give to clients

How much do you give to clients

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I have a couple of clients who just want me to do the Ltd Co accounts.  They want to save money by doing their own VAT, payroll and personal tax.

Do you still give advice? 

The job I am currently working on has some VAT errors - I will point those out to the client - its nothing major but lots of little errors.  The director has paid a wage of £950 per month. Dividends have not been used. 

I will more than likely go through these things with her, but its annoying to advise for free! 

Replies (10)

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By cheekychappy
06th Apr 2016 11:48

I would highlight the VAT errors and tell them to amend them.

I would comment that they are probably costing themselves more in income tax than they need to and that they should revaluate the salary they are paying themselves.

I will give them pointers, but not detailed advice. Detailed advice costs money.

Thanks (2)
By Duggimon
06th Apr 2016 12:29

Pretty much the same

VAT is part of the accounts so I would be reconciling that and correcting any errors because otherwise the accounts would be wrong. I'd pass any adjustment required back to the client to stick on the next return. I'd probably check PAYE in much the same way in case of any errors there.

Regarding tax planning, I think I'd always advise clients of anything they were obviously doing wrong such as drawing all their money as salary when dividends are more efficient. I'm charging them for my time spent on the meetings so getting paid for providing the advice and it would seem a little churlish to withhold the information simply because they want to prepare their own SATR.

I'd be sure to point out we could make certain of the most efficient tax structure if I was also doing their personal tax and had all the relevant information for that but I wouldn't deliberately avoid advising them they were in the wrong if they refused.

Thanks (1)
ghm
By TaxTeddy
06th Apr 2016 12:31

You can't re-educate them

Penny pinching is a classic sign of a client who won't see the value in advice you give. I agree with CheekyChappy - just tell them the basics.

Thanks (1)
PJ
By paulgrca.net
06th Apr 2016 12:37

Of course you must tell

them of any errors that you spot that is not giving free advice!

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By SteveHa
06th Apr 2016 12:39

I don't give clients anything - they pay me.

Oh, I see, you weren't talking about money. Then it depends on the client. If they are a high value client (and they can be even without the form filling) then I'd be more likely to give additional advice to keep them than the waste of time client.

Thanks (1)
By thatsnumberwang
06th Apr 2016 12:39

Client mistakes

I recently received the books for a Ltd company client which were in a shocking state due to him doing the books himself. I gave the client of list of issues and told them I couldn't honour the fee I had quoted. He could pay me £x amount more to resolve the issues or find another accountant. 

Unfortunately he decided to pay the extra cash, which was annoying. 

I knew an accountant once who gave a range of fees based on the quality of the bookkeeping ie books in poor order are £x more expensive than books in poor order and a list of common issues he encountered. I would imagine it only takes one year of having to stump up the higher fee before they decide it's a false economy.

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avatar
By thomas
06th Apr 2016 13:01

The client has also put through expense claims for a personal mobile phone which is used 50/50 personal/business.  Its a fixed contract rate.  She has claimed the VAT on it as well. 

I don't think she can put through anything or claim the VAT as she cannot identify the business calls.  I just wish she had talked to me at the beginning and I could have advised her on the basics.

She was trying to haggle over £25 in the fee as well.  It was definitely a sign...

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Replying to Open all hours:
Red Leader
By Red Leader
06th Apr 2016 14:24

what's that?

thomas wrote:

The client has also put through expense claims for a personal mobile phone which is used 50/50 personal/business.  Its a fixed contract rate.  She has claimed the VAT on it as well. 

I don't think she can put through anything or claim the VAT as she cannot identify the business calls.  I just wish she had talked to me at the beginning and I could have advised her on the basics.

She was trying to haggle over £25 in the fee as well.  It was definitely a sign...

It's the writing on the wall.

Thanks (1)
Glenn Martin
By Glenn Martin
06th Apr 2016 13:13

Upsell to the client

When you point out the errors on the VAT, mention that you would take on the VAT returns for X amount per year, and that if VAT picked up on her errors what the penalties could be.

When I price a job now I have sort of 2 levels of fees one is priced right, which includes about a 25% uplift over the standard job to allow for additional advice and support during the year, this I feel allows me to do a good job. If they haggle and looking for a cheaper job I may agree to do it but it then becomes a basic no frills job. I suppose its the difference between a grade A and C client.

What I don't do anymore is the champagne job for beer money, which was a mistake i got into in my first few years.

Thanks (1)
By ireallyshouldknowthisbut
07th Apr 2016 10:27

.

On the wages, I would work it out.  I would say "I can save you £XXXX on youe salary/dividend split if we do it, it will cost you Y, and you will be Z up"

And I would add some cash to Y over and above our normal rate.

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