Late filing penalty

SA1516

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New client, requested to go into SA from 15/16 (as thought he would need to) but forgot to submit the return, received late filing penalty, paid it.  Has now passed paperwork to me (turns out he is in a repayment position) as only PAYE income 

Has anyone been successful in asking HMRC to remove from SA? No additional tax to pay but does paying the £100 penalty prevent him exiting SA?

If I submit the return now- it will trigger a whole heap of penalties.  Am mindful of the 31 July deadline aswell.

Thoughts?  

 

Replies (10)

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RLI
By lionofludesch
27th Jul 2017 18:42

Eh dear.

Not been in that position myself but there's plenty of anecdotal stuff on this forum about the need to get the return withdrawn and not submit it under any circumstances.

Has he paid the £100 ? He's not far off the full £900 of £10 a day penalties if he does indeed tiurn out to be in the penalty system. Plus another £300 on Tuesday.

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By Tim Vane
27th Jul 2017 18:46

Is this a serious question? If he is on PAYE then HMRC are unlikely to have any problem removing him from SA. Then you could ask them to cancel the return. Then ask for the penalty to be vacated. Then he can get the money back.

I'm glad you're mindful of the date, but what does a 31 July deadline have to do with a taxpayer on PAYE?

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By Justin Bryant
27th Jul 2017 18:52

I would phone HMRC asking that they withdraw the tax return notices, since there was no tax payable. See:

http://taxaid.org.uk/guides/taxpayers/tax-returns/late-filing-penalties-...

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By lja20
27th Jul 2017 19:29

Thanks - I will call HMRC, I hope, him requesting SA (he thought he needed to (but he didn't) and was being organised?!) and paying the penalty - he did pay it, doesn't prohibit HMRC withdrawing the notice.

Lets see what they say tomorrow....

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By SteveHa
27th Jul 2017 20:27

I have a similar one right now, was a company shareholder, and partner of the director, until that all went south. He never replied to any requests for information and it was only a bit of sleuthing on my part that got a current address. Still no reply.

Now that daily penalties have kicked in for 2015/16, he found the exit from the woodwork. Return almost complete and due a refund (that will be wiped out by penalties). Still awaiting a final bit of information (which will increase the refund), so toying with the idea of going for an 8B withdrawal, but not massively confident in this case.

I may also get away with reasonable excuse, but not hugely confident on that, either.

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By Paul D Utherone
27th Jul 2017 20:58

I would call HMRC. Say he registered in error and has no need to be in SA for 2015-16 and will they please accept a claim under TMS s8B to withdraw the requirement to submit a return.

In case you end up at tribunal it may be better to make a formal written request to confirm the request made by phone to get it on record, or at the very least keep records of the date & time of the call and what was discussed.

Beware being told by the helpline that the client must submit and then appeal the filing penalty, because that way you will lose at tribunal, and by submitting lose the option of a claim to withdraw under s8B

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By lja20
28th Jul 2017 09:48

UPDATE: HMRC have agreed to withdraw the SA record, refund of £100 being triggered. The tax refund on overpaid PAYE will also be triggered by the PAYE reconciliation (which will commence now the SA record has been closed).
Many thanks for comments.

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Replying to lja20:
By Paul D Utherone
28th Jul 2017 09:49

Result!

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Replying to lja20:
RLI
By lionofludesch
28th Jul 2017 11:20

Thanks for letting us know.

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By Justin Bryant
28th Sep 2017 17:50

HMRC should not charge penalties in this situation in any event. See:

http://financeandtax.decisions.tribunals.gov.uk/judgmentfiles/j10082/TC0...

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