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Late P35 form

Late P35 form

I filled in P14 and thought I had successfully filled in P35 form on line, on time.

On th 3.05.2011 I logged onto HMRC web site and had no doubt that I had completed the forms P14 and P35.

First notification of the 'failure' was received on 20.02.2012 over 9 months after the deadline of 18th May 2011. 

The fine that has been levied is £800.00. 

On 20.02.2012 I entered the HMRC site to find that the P14 had been recorded as being successful but no record of P 35 had been logged on the HMRC site. I completed the P35 which now shows a completion date 20.02.2012  

When I first went on line on 3.05.2011, I printed out the P35 summary page which shows a date prior to the deadline. 

I have submitted an appeal which has been rejected. In the Justification by the inspector he notes 'In your letter you state the end of the year 2010-11 return P35 was submitted before the deadline, however online services records show that you had logged on 5th May 2012 but did not submit your return, no successful submissions were made until 20th February 2012.......' The date as underlined above has not happened yet and is an error made by the Inspector. The date in the letter he refers to is in fact 3.05.2011.

All tax and NI due, had been paid in full and on time. No additional tax or NI is due to HMRC

 I think this is a rip-off by HMRC and is far worse than wheel clamping 

I have been given a choice as follows

  • To have an independent review of the inspectors decision or
  • To submit my appeal to the Tribunal Service

Can anyone help me


    All tax and NI due, had been paid in full and on time. No addittional tax or NI is due to HMRC  


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03rd Apr 2012 07:01

Somewhere on aweb

there is an article on reasonable excuse.  And I am sure in that article there is a summary of the case in which someone who could show that they reasonably thought they had filed their return had a penalty waived.

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03rd Apr 2012 08:11

To give you some hope, in

all of this, my son-in-law was in exactly the same situation.

He and the lady who completes his payroll submitted an appeal, followed by detailed explanation and, still, HMRC rejected their arguments.

I suggested that they take the case to a first tier tribunal, which they did. As soon as a date had been fixed and notified, HMRC cynically (in my opinion) suggested that they had reviewed the case again and, there were grounds for removal of the penalties. The original £800 penalty was reduced to no;.

The message here is that, no matter how much time it may take and, how many explanations are required, stick at it and you should overcome this grubby aspect of the Paye regulations.

In my 40 years of dealing with HMRC I never once thought I would use the phrase "grubby"! Shameful, isn't it?

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By ACDWebb
03rd Apr 2012 08:36

Whilst not on all fours with your case

you might want to have a read of TCO1899 particularly the bits on page 9 re reasonable belief

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03rd Apr 2012 08:52

Fine is capped at £100...

... if all tax due was paid by April 19th.

In this situation if they aren't capping the penalty to £100 once you've filed and they can see that no tax was due, then ask them why they aren't following their own clearly laid down staff manual on how to handle late P35 cases?

Link: http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/cogmanual/COG914045.htm

The relevant sentence is near the bottom of the page and begins, "By Concession..."

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03rd Apr 2012 22:23

Reasonable Excuse
There must be grounds for reasonable excuse here even if only with regard to the size of the penalty. However, I cannot see why the penalty should be capped at £100 Tom based on the liability? I think I must be reading it differently to you. The fine is I believe capped to the PAYE/ nic recorded on the P35. The fact it's been paid is irrelevant surely?

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04th Apr 2012 07:06

The wording of the concession....

"By concession the penalty is ‘capped’ to the total liability payable by 19th April following the end of the tax year, subject to a minimum penalty of £100."

If it has been paid by April 19th then it is no longer payable by that date. If they meant the total liability for the year there would be no need to mention April 19th in the concession at all and the wording would simply be "...the total liability for the tax year, subject...

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