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Negative box 4 gives HMRC error

Negative box 4 gives HMRC error

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My client submitted a VAT return with a negative box 4 figure (first time I have seen this in 17 years of practice) because of a purchase refund.  His box 5 was positive £1437.26 and he paid it as normal.  But the following narrative has appeared in the gateway account:

Refund payment from HMRC  £1437.26

As you requested a refund on an overpayment you made.

We await to see if a refund will be made.  His VAT account is zero (as it should be).  Has anyone else come across this?

Thanks

 

 

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17th Jun 2019 10:50

This may be the issue about box 5 having to be an absolute value. Can you please provide all the first 5 box values (with their signs)?

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17th Jun 2019 12:25

Yes the boxes are as follows
1232.00
0.00
1232.00
(205.26)
1437.26

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to Ian Lawrence
17th Jun 2019 12:57

Is this through MTD or the portal?

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17th Jun 2019 13:03

This is MTD

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to Ian Lawrence
17th Jun 2019 13:06

I will send you a message about this, but I think it needs a bit of checking out via the apis using a different MTD provider.

One potential cause is that your MTD software has got confused and messed up the signs. It is worth excluding that as an issue.

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17th Jun 2019 13:19

Thanks for your offer. The VAT account is zero with HMRC so I think the signs are correct. I will wait to see if they send a refund or any problems are caused but if they don't then I will put it down to an HMRC issue with narratives.

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to Ian Lawrence
17th Jun 2019 13:35

In theory it is currently not supposed to be possible (until 5pm) to look up balances anyway.

They probably will get things going before 5pm. Hence one has to raise an element of uncertainty about any information from HMRC servers during the downtime period.

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17th Jun 2019 13:41

Ah I see thank you. I will check tomorrow and see if things have changed

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to Ian Lawrence
17th Jun 2019 14:16

Additionally they say that people cannot submit returns today. Further details are on my website (including a link to HMRC's site)
https://www.vat.direct

Hence if you submitted a return today it raises a question as to whether you might have to submit one again.

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to johnhemming
17th Jun 2019 18:05

johnhemming wrote:

Additionally they say that people cannot submit returns today. Further details are on my website (including a link to HMRC's site)
https://www.vat.direct

Hence if you submitted a return today it raises a question as to whether you might have to submit one again.

Frigging marvellous

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to atleastisoundknowledgable...
17th Jun 2019 18:50

atleastisoundknowledgable... wrote:

Frigging marvellous


They do have to switch it off for a bit in order to reorder the cogs.

The way their systems work is that there are a number of interconnected systems so the API itself is still like to give a response (which should be 500, but may not be).

However, tomorrow is another day.

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17th Jun 2019 14:31

Thanks John I haven't submitted any today

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18th Jun 2019 17:02

No further progress today. The VAT account shows exactly the same. I shall post again if a refund is processed.

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to Ian Lawrence
18th Jun 2019 18:42

It is worth finding out what the obligations API says in the sense of what is on HMRC's servers for the submission.

That will tell you what is likely to happen at the appropriate time for either a DD or BACS payment.

The other APIs could help with this as well.

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