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P35 rejected

P35 rejected

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Rejection notice states that the employer has been invited to join RTI and i remember reading a post a week or so ago that you can call HMRC and get them taken out of the RTI pilot or use the HMRC online tools.  It was a new client so I didnt have authority processed so thought I would try and send off an FBI2 to see if it processed quicker than the 64-8.  The FBI-2 went through in a couple of days and no sign of the 64-8 being processed so thought I would process the P35 vian the HMRC online PAYE tools.

So i add the sole employee and it then comes up with the following message:

Please note:Forms P11D and P9D are only available for completion and submission for the tax year ended 5 April 2013. However, you can still view, print or store previously submitted P11D and P9D forms using this service.

So what are my options now?  Why does the HMRC own online software not handle the RTI pilot and allow you to file a P35 for the 2012/13 tax year?

I can find the thread I remember reading so a link to that would be useful if the original poster got the issue resolved.

Thanks.

Replies (18)

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Out of my mind
By runningmate
22nd Apr 2013 23:24

Could it be because any employer filing under RTI does not submit a P35 (because the final FPS of the year effectively 'doubles' as the P35)?

RM

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By dnicholson
23rd Apr 2013 00:11

In RTI

The message means that the scheme is in RTI for last year, so you can't file a P35. However you're now past the deadline for an FPS for last year, so you can only file an Earlier Years Update (by May 19th). If you can persuade HMRC to take them out of last year's RTI pilot you'll have until May 19th to file the P35.

If you're using HMRC tools, there's a note about EYU here http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/rti/emp-monthly-update-apr13.pdf.

As an aside, you don't need authority to file P35 or RTI.

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By jjswjjsw
23rd Apr 2013 08:27

Moneysoft

I'm sure you use Moneysoft and with them you can turn a 2012/13 payroll into an RTI-enabled 2012/13 payroll, whether the software has the functionality for the EYU I don't know but it might be worth a word with them.

See Richard Carey's link from here https://www.accountingweb.co.uk/anyanswers/question/p35-being-rejected-because-hmrc-have-set-rti-flag and then item 3 and the key combinations part way down the Moneysoft help page. 

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By MissAccounting
23rd Apr 2013 08:37

Thanks all.

Of course, how did I overlook the fact that there isnt a P35 due because of the early RTI adoption!  It was a clearly 2 late nights that I was working on this client!

Thanks for the link jjswjjsq and yes I do use moneysoft so will contact them.

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By Richard_Carey
23rd Apr 2013 08:58

@MissAccounting

Please send an email to [email protected] asking about the Earlier Year Update (EYU), which will allow you to send RTI information for 2012-13. We will then get back to you with further details about how to send this using Moneysoft..

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By cathyne
26th Apr 2013 20:29

Moneysoft EYU

HMMM.. I just received this from Moneysoft

'Our advice from the HMRC is to contact them and ask to be switched back to filing P35s, which you can then file from our program by removing the RTI Start Date.' Which is fine, if you can get through to HMRC. Moneysoft do not appear to have the EYU function. Or does anyone know different?

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By E Lewis
28th Apr 2013 12:55

P35 reject and RTI pilot scheme

I have a payroll client with 2 employees which started in December 2012. HMRC put him on the RTI pilot without advising him -  or me for that matter. Anyway, the first i reaised it was when the P35 was rejected . As i use IRIS Bureau, i contacted them to resolve the issue. Since that i've been given the run around with IRIS and HMRC . I can't file the 2012/13 P35 online as the payroll is on RTI and i cant do an earlier year adjustment (EYU) as IRIS Bureau doesn't seem to be able to do it - even though they say they can. I have spent hours on the phone about this and i'm now desperate. my only option is to use HMRC Basic PAYE Tools EYU update which will only be issed after 19/5/13. this is absolutely ridiculous  when i've paid for IRIS and they can't solve the problem.

this is a very long story so ive had to compress it a lot.

Any suggestions?

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Replying to lionofludesch:
Tom McClelland
By TomMcClelland
28th Apr 2013 18:21

Easy if no 12/13 RTI returns made by that client

E Lewis wrote:

I have a payroll client with 2 employees which started in December 2012. HMRC put him on the RTI pilot without advising him -  or me for that matter. Anyway, the first i reaised it was when the P35 was rejected . As i use IRIS Bureau, i contacted them to resolve the issue. Since that i've been given the run around with IRIS and HMRC . I can't file the 2012/13 P35 online as the payroll is on RTI and i cant do an earlier year adjustment (EYU) as IRIS Bureau doesn't seem to be able to do it - even though they say they can. I have spent hours on the phone about this and i'm now desperate. my only option is to use HMRC Basic PAYE Tools EYU update which will only be issed after 19/5/13. this is absolutely ridiculous  when i've paid for IRIS and they can't solve the problem.

this is a very long story so ive had to compress it a lot.

Any suggestions?

The easiest way of dealing with this is to ask HMRC to move the employer's RTI start date to 6th April. The office to call is the New Employer Helpline (0300 200 3211)
 

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Out of my mind
By runningmate
28th Apr 2013 13:06

Sometimes it helps to kick the cat (if you have one)!  Much more healthy than hitting the bottle . . .

RM

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By E Lewis
28th Apr 2013 15:08

Hello runningmate

By then, I felt that I needed to lay down in a darkened room with a large glass of wine – but of course I couldn't do that as firstly, I wouldn't be able to see the glass and thus throw the wine all over me and secondly I couldn't be tiddly in charge of a keyboard and phone.

no cat available fortunately.

Seriously though, i just can't believe the problem i'm in. i suppose that i will just have to wait for the HMRC EYU update on their website. i have emailed IRIS in the hope that they can sort it out -hmmm.

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Out of my mind
By runningmate
28th Apr 2013 15:27

Sadly the software you need currently does not exist.  You are simply stuck!

RM

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By cathyne
28th Apr 2013 20:05

start date

When you do get through to HMRC, yes they can change the 'mandation' date to 6 April 2013 which is lovely.BUT if you've already filed a submission for 2013/14,which I have, they can't change the date. Thus back to Sq 1, and wait for PAYE tools,the 2012 version of which the same HMRC person,reliably told me,can file a submission for 2012/13. We'llsee........

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By E Lewis
29th Apr 2013 15:00

Thank you all for your comments.

Cathyne - your comment strikes a chord as i have filed a FPS for April 2013 so basically i'm stumped unitl the update comes through on PAYE tools. Nervertheless i'll have one last go with HMRC in case i'm lucky. Otherwaise i;ll have to wait until after 19/5/13.............

 

 

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By E Lewis
02nd May 2013 11:03

Latest P35 update

Further to my comments above, I thought that I would let everyone know, IRIS came up trumps about the P35. They have a contact in HMRC who was able to transfer the RTI starting date from December 12 to 6/4/13 so I was able to file the P35/P14 online to HMRC without any problems at all.

However, what Ii would like to know though - how did the HMRC contact manage to change the date when 4 people at the HMRC Employers Help Line couldn't do it. It really shows that 'the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing'. This has caused me a great deal of time, effort and anxiety but it's done now at last!

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Replying to johnjenkins:
Tom McClelland
By TomMcClelland
02nd May 2013 11:11

Strange

E Lewis wrote:

Further to my comments above, I thought that I would let everyone know, IRIS came up trumps about the P35. They have a contact in HMRC who was able to transfer the RTI starting date from December 12 to 6/4/13 so I was able to file the P35/P14 online to HMRC without any problems at all.

However, what Ii would like to know though - how did the HMRC contact manage to change the date when 4 people at the HMRC Employers Help Line couldn't do it. It really shows that 'the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing'. This has caused me a great deal of time, effort and anxiety but it's done now at last!

Did you specifically authorise HMRC to talk to Iris about your PAYE affairs? If not it sounds as if whatever happened broke a whole pile of regulations. HMRC staff are forbidden to talk to software developers (be that 12Pay, Iris, Sage, or whoever) about the specific live PAYE affairs of individual clients. That would be a recipe for a data protection nightmare. If I ring one of my HMRC contacts up asking about a client's affairs how are they to know that I'm entitled to ask those questions?

But the other mystifying thing about the story is why it was dififcult to change the date in the first place? We've had numerous clients do it without issue. You do have to ring the correct helpline (the New Employer Helpline 0300 200 3211)), and then it just goes through.

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By dnicholson
02nd May 2013 12:19

Agree with Tom

I'd second Tom's comment. Software suppliers generally have contact with the developer support team, who can't access live data.

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By E Lewis
03rd May 2013 10:48

Authority was given!!!

let me just say - it was really difficult to change the date. I had to go through so many hoops to do it. my previous emails refer.

Yes - I did contact the New Employer Help Line - 4 times in fact, as well as 2 calls to the HMRC online services.

Anyway , thanks to everyone who advised me with their suggestions.

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Tom McClelland
By TomMcClelland
03rd May 2013 16:25

Persistence

Just spoke to someone who called once and was told they couldn't change their mandation date. They called again, got someone different, and promptly got it changed...

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