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Pub cash weekly wages paid in cash

Pub cash weekly wages paid in cash

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I have a pub client whose wages I process 4 weekly.  The pot washers, however, are paid weekly in cash and I process what they have been paid on each 4 weekly pay run - there is never any PAYE on their low earnings (well so far anyway!).  Now the RTI penalty regime has arrived I'm worried about carrying on with the set up.  They have 15 staff.  Can anyone advise what the current situation is?

Thank you. 

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By memyself-eye
13th Apr 2015 11:39

not unusual

for those in a pub to be paid cash - we've been doing it that way for years. Presumably the pot washers are included in the normal payroll runs?

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By Home bookkeeper
13th Apr 2015 11:49

Yes, on the 4 weekly wage runs the client adds up what they have been paid in cash for the previous 4 weeks and I then produce a payslip.  I'm concerned that since RTI this is no longer an acceptable way of doing it though, due to the 'on or before' requirement.

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By Pelican
13th Apr 2015 11:52

I carry out a weekly payroll for all employees at the pub I do the accounts for. 

I use the payroll software on Xero to carry this out as it doesnt take long to enter the details and with one click of a button it is submitted to HMRC 

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By Home bookkeeper
13th Apr 2015 12:21

Hi Pelican.

The client prefers doing it the way that they've always done it.  They don't want to have to tell me the cash amounts every week, or pay me for running a weekly payroll.  My question is: are we actually allowed to continue running the way we have been doing? 

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By Euan MacLennan
13th Apr 2015 12:31

Prepare for penalties if HMRC finds out.

The easement of the "on or before" filing requirement to allow employers who pay weekly to file just one monthly FPS on or before the last payday of the month only applies to employers with 9 or fewer staff and then, only up to April 2016.  I think you can assume that it means up to 9 employees being paid in the particular month, but if you are actually paying most of the 15 staff every month, you have been in breach of the RTI requirements from April 2014.

If you do not qualify for the easement, you are subject to RTI in the usual way.  Either the pub must change its practices and pay the pot washers every 4 weeks (or pay everybody weekly) or you will need to run two payrolls - one weekly and one 4 weekly.

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Replying to ireallyshouldknowthisbut:
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By Home bookkeeper
13th Apr 2015 12:38

Others doing the same?

Euan MacLennan wrote:

Prepare for penalties if HMRC finds out.

The easement of the "on or before" filing requirement to allow employers who pay weekly to file just one monthly FPS on or before the last payday of the month only applies to employers with 9 or fewer staff and then, only up to April 2016.  I think you can assume that it means up to 9 employees being paid in the particular month, but if you are actually paying most of the 15 staff every month, you have been in breach of the RTI requirements from April 2014.

If you do not qualify for the easement, you are subject to RTI in the usual way.  Either the pub must change its practices and pay the pot washers every 4 weeks (or pay everybody weekly) or you will need to run two payrolls - one weekly and one 4 weekly.

 

I'm assuming that a lot of payroll for similar businesses is ran in the way that I have bee doing it. What are other people doing?

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By NYB
13th Apr 2015 12:50

The rules are quite clear. FPS to be submitted on or before pay. Clearly if someone is paid weekly it is not correct to be reporting four weekly. . No doubt many may operate in the way the pub is, but it is not correct as far as HMRC are concerned. Be it on your own heads. No matter what the client " wants" it should be carried out in line with the legislation. Pay the pot washers every four weeks. They'll get used to it! Then everyone is in the clear.

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By coolmanwithbeard
13th Apr 2015 13:11

Do them in advance

I have a couple of schemes with weekly and monthly staff - we now have an agreed weekly amount and when I do a monthly payroll I then run and submit RTI for weekly until the next month. We catch up on the next monthly week (if you see what I mean). I advise that large changes should be notified immediately  and it seems to work. 

 

I guess it's still not strictly correct but certainly its closer and some months it is spot on!

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Teignmouth
By Paul Scholes
13th Apr 2015 13:30

My pub client has moved all to 4 weeks

For precisely the above reason my pub client is moving all staff to 4 weekly pay.

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By Home bookkeeper
13th Apr 2015 14:09

Thanks everyone or your responses, very helpful. I will advise my client to either switch the weekly paid staff to 4 weekly or for me to run weekly submissions. 

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By aland
13th Apr 2015 14:37

Loan instead

Pub could try calling the first 3 payments a loan, to be repaid on the 4th payday.

I expect it bends some of the rules, but might be acceptable. Pub needs to be made aware of this effect, brought about by RTI.

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