Redundancy during furlough

How to do or shouldnt they

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After a further review a client with 50 employees  has stated that they need to make 5 furloughed employees redundant, is that advisable or even possible. All help gratefully received. Nick

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RLI
By lionofludesch
15th Apr 2020 13:24

On ethical grounds, I wouldn't.

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Replying to lionofludesch:
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By carnmores
15th Apr 2020 13:53

My thought too

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By Matrix
15th Apr 2020 13:33

I think your client is big enough to use an HR specialist or lawyer.

One client has only 5 employees, one has resigned during furlough but I have asked them to take advice (since I think the employee cannot be furloughed during notice period).

I think we are in danger of becoming HR advisers.

If you really want to help Nick then I would just copy and paste from the government rules since this is all we have to go on. Although once not on furlough anymore I would imagine they would revert to their contract.

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Replying to Matrix:
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By carnmores
15th Apr 2020 13:52

I agree my EAT contact says you can but not until 3 weeks after furloghing

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RLI
By lionofludesch
15th Apr 2020 13:59

I can't see there's anything to be gained at the moment, whilst the employee has, potentially, a massive amount to lose. He could see his income cut off whereas delaying the redundancy would see 80% of his income continue at no cost to the employer.

By all means start the process but to complete the redundancy whilst furlough is in progress is, imho, massively disrespectful to the employees concerned. If I were one of the remaining 45 employees, I'd be watching and taking notes.

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Replying to lionofludesch:
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By paul.benny
15th Apr 2020 14:32

Agree fully. Why sh t on your staff when there is no need to do so.

No real need even to start the process. The formal consultation period does not need to be long.

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By SteveHa
15th Apr 2020 14:03

I don't see why it can't be done. Although, as others have said, I don't see why it would or should be done.

Only the employee loses. The employer has nothing to either gain or lose (except, potentially, an employee he may need at the end of all this).

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paddle steamer
By DJKL
15th Apr 2020 14:55

Selection for redundancy and consultation seem to be the tricky issues, why a particular five, how were they selected out of the 50 etc etc?

In addition if redundancy payments/holiday pay arrears will need paid now (which cannot be deferred and will not be subsidised by the state) it seems possibly detrimental to immediate cashflow.

Certainly not a good message to send to the remaining 45, in effect, if redundancy payments will arise employer is saying " you are only costing 20% of what you normally cost but we are prepared to axe you and possibly spend far more money than your wages so doing"

If no redundancy payments will be due the message is, "we are complete heartless b******s who discard our employees"

Have they explored other options or is redundancy/dismissal their default kneejerk reaction?

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Replying to DJKL:
RLI
By lionofludesch
16th Apr 2020 10:24

DJKL wrote:

Certainly not a good message to send to the remaining 45, in effect, if redundancy payments will arise employer is saying " you are only costing 20% of what you normally cost but we are prepared to axe you and possibly spend far more money than your wages so doing"

20% ? I'd say nothing.

People remember this stuff when a crisis is over. Don't think they won't. And word gets around.

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