New client switched to us who is already signed into MTD for VAT.
Spent a good few days becoming frustrated at the normal easy online agent authorisation process not working which was giving the answer 'failed'.
Checked the normal stuff like date of reg, last return submitted etc but couldn't get to work.
Light bulb moment thinking that of course if HMRC could mess up something that had worked for eons as part of their digital revolution then they would do so.
Sure enough there is a new process to be added as an agent if the client is already in MTD.
Follow this link https://www.gov.uk/guidance/authorise-new-clients-for-your-agent-services-account
Log in with new ASA gateway code. Put in the clients VAT details then they get an email which they MUST click and log in with their own BTA credentials. Lots of assumptions by HMRC that clients have emails and BTA's going on here, but never mind its the future, innit.
(To be fair it was easier than waiting for the letter to be issued, client saying they never received it etc etc).
Client instantly appeared on my Agent Services Account the second they clicked the email (not my Online Services for Agents Account (yes HMRC you are total muppets for your naming conventions)) and software switched on successfully.
Looks like the phase out of the old gateway has started as MTD clients won't appear in your old VAT client list so everything will have to be done in the new ASA. Lucky they built such a super awesome ASA for live date.............
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Another pointer, the client can have their VAT account setup on a Personal or Business login (even for companies). So the link can fail unless you pick the right one - which of course you don't know which one it is unless it fails.
If you don't know that it can just seem to be failing completely when it will actually work, just change the client type and retry.
That's really useful, thanks for pointing it out.
So if the client doesn't have a BTA..................
I assume we are back on paper 64-8's?
I registered a BTA for a client yesterday (he was in the office with me, I wasn't just doing it for my own benefit) and it took all of three minutes to complete.
VAT online accounts don't seem to require the authentication PIN sent out by mail, the functionality was available immediately.
We were doing it to set up his d/d, I'm not 100% sure you can immediately add an agent or if that requires additional registration for the "manage details" service under the VAT login.
I have spent some time talking to HMRC to understand the new processes.
As I understand it the plan for the new authorisation process (which works through the Agents API or using a link via the ASA) is that it will over time replace the 64-8 for the appointment of agents for any one tax.
However, at the moment the new system only transfers a new client onto the new agents ASA. It does not act as a generalised appointment of an agent in the same way as the pin number or the 64-8 does. Hence if you want to phone up HMRC on behalf of your client you will also have to do the other system.
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It does not act as a generalised appointment of an agent in the same way as the pin number or the 64-8 does. Hence if you want to phone up HMRC on behalf of your client you will also have to do the other system.
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Yes, that is my understanding too. Therefore, in my mind accountants are wasting their time with the new digital authorisation, as they will additionally have to apply for the old 64-8 in addition if they want to be the VAT agent.
The only reason I might use the new method, is if for some reason a new client needs to file a VAT Return by us asap, and we cannot wait for the VT 64-8 code to come in the post.
This new digital authorisation is really therefore only a Beta test for HMRC to know that some of it is working before they add on additional functionality.
New clients you authorise by 64-8 are automatically available for you to access their MTD VAT account, if you have previously linked your ASA to your old Agent Government Gateway.
This new digital authorisation is really therefore only a Beta test for HMRC to know that some of it is working before they add on additional functionality.
I would not say that. I think it is a question moreso of HMRC changing their internal systems so that the new appointment system feeds into the old data.
I can see the argument that if you are going to do 64-8 then you might as well not do the other one. However, as a process one takes minutes and the other takes over a week and possibly two weeks.
Everyone, of course, can establish their own procedures for this. However, as the one process is really fast it is worth using it.
I have not managed to find out when the planned date is for extending the new process so it handles all of 64-8.
That's an interesting point. Obviously it remains possible to do a manual 64-8. That, however, will take a lot longer.
I will try to find out what HMRC's view is on this.
Now I have a confirmation from HMRC about the pin number system and MTD I have written a summary article on Industry Insights which is here:
https://www.accountingweb.co.uk/community/industry-insights/hmrc-confirm...
You can authorise your client via old agent gateway using authorisation code.
You just need to find out the details of the last vat return sent the old way and put it in authorisation fields.
If the client is registered for MTD since the beginning you put :
- Final month of last VAT return submitted:* - N/A
- Box 5 figure on last VAT return submitted: - 0
and it goes through.
Once you've entered the code after 3-4 days the client will appear in old and new account - ASA.
Does anyone have an update on this as I'm trying to authorise a new client who doesn't have a Gateway so can't use the new system on Agent Services. Tried putting in n/a and 0 but still doesn't work - any ideas please? Or do we have to send in a 64-8