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Tax return penalties 2004

What were they?

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I have just taken on a new CIS client and he has outstanding tax penalties and interest from 2004.  He says he cannot recall how this happened but looking back on his account it would seem that  a tax return wasn't submitted and tax has been determined by HMRC.  There are two £100 penalties in 2005 as could be expected, but then a further penalty of £210 in Jan 2008.  I remember the £100 penalties if tax is outstanding but not the additional £210.  Can anyone shred any light on what this is?

 

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11th Jul 2019 13:01

Late payment penalty?

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11th Jul 2019 13:05

Would these have been tax related penalties?

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11th Jul 2019 13:16

Do you know what the tax determined figure was?

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to gainsborough
11th Jul 2019 14:58

gainsborough wrote:

Do you know what the tax determined figure was?

Yes £950 in Oct 2005

To Moonbeam and Wanderer £100 late tax return penalties in March and Sept 2005 and £210 penalty in Jan 2008 but doesn't say what it was. Interest is accruing on all 3 penalties plus the tax determination.

I just did a quick recce on penalties under the new regime using the HMRC calculator and it says £142.50 late payment penalty, although I appreciate things may have been different back then

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to legerman
11th Jul 2019 15:51

Hmmm...yes, had expected to see 15% of the £950...and this return would have been before the daily £10 penalty came in, so I am baffled....

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to gainsborough
11th Jul 2019 17:03

gainsborough wrote:

Hmmm...yes, had expected to see 15% of the £950...and this return would have been before the daily £10 penalty came in, so I am baffled....

I've just spoken to HMRC and apparently it's a penalty charge of £15 a day for 14 days, from Dec 2007 to Jan 2008, so now I am confused!!

I am appealing all the charges anyway because whoever was his accountant submitted the following 3 years tax returns in one go in 2007 and there have been no penalties incurred (as you'd expect with him being CIS) so my argument will be that no tax was due for 2003/4. There are no further self assessments until 2017/18, which I have submitted.

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to legerman
11th Jul 2019 18:39

Good luck with the appeal legerman - let us know how you get on!

Had forgotten all about this until I looked at the legislation again but the provisions for daily penalties were always there in TMA 1970 s93 - apparently up to £60 per day for pre 2009/10 returns - guess it wasn't really publicised much until 2010.

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