I run a £2 mill practice
I'm a shareholder in a VC firm
I'm FD of a £20m t/o manufacturing business
I have no external debt (other than the usual trade creditors)
Does any bank want my business?
No
Natwest have ignored my pleas for Internet banking access for 20 weeks
Lloyds have asked for everything but my inside leg measurement and a full credit risk profile just to consider opening an account
Barclays said my affairs are too complex
TSB couldn't take my enquiry without an account number ("but I'm trying to open an account" being my frustrated reply)
HSBC don't return calls
Handlesbanken looked bored for 40 mins and them emailed me a week later saying they couldn't help at this time
Aldermore don't do normal accounts
Metro only deal with London accounts
Is there anyone else - do they actually want any business?
Replies (26)
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Given your position
Don't you already have a decent business banking relationship somewhere? Or a personal premier account manager to directly refer to at least?
Adam & Co
If you are a high net worth individual, especially if you have liquid funds, I expect Adam & Co would love you.
Catch is they are Edinburgh based but as they are part of RBOS they may pass you to Coutts.
Adam are not cheap but in the past their service levels were excellent, you had a named relationship manager and they always returned calls. Turn around times pre 2007 were great re loan applications, not sure if they are still retracting their loan book or if they are trying to expand it again. (none of the banks seem to be able to make up their mind what they actually want to do these days)
I have not had a great deal to do with them re new business in recent years, merely closing out a loan position and general maintenance of existing accounts, but having spent since 1997 dealing with Clydesdale, Bank of Scotland, Royal Bank and Adam & Co, Adam have been head and shoulders above the rest re quality of service.
Apparently..............
Banks have all been told to avoid accountants and solicitors at all costs.
Of course, it will all change when the recession ends and they will be falling over themselves to lend. Like last time, and the time before etc, etc.
You have obviously been tainted by the "Accountants" brush Steve and their tiny minds don't work any farther than that.
Surely...
Surely the bank where you are FD would sort you out, or they might find themselves losing that business.
Santander
I don't have Steve's profile but I had very similar problems when trying to change banks. The best of a bad lot was Santander's commercial arm. Still going through the process but seems ok so far.
Banks
Unbelievably odd that they are turning away business, fools. I can wholeheartedly recommend Santander. I have been with them since I started in practice in 1991 (they were Abbey then), they have got things wrong once or twice, which has led me to complain. I got an apology and £50 the first time, another apology and a case of (very) nice wine the second time. It is not what they do wrong, it is what they do to put it right that matters. Each issue I raised has been corrected in their system to prevent repeats with other account holders.
Banks !!
About 2 years ago I wished to invest a smallish amount (£10k) into a fixed rate bond. Natwest were offering the best rates. I visited the local branch, gave over my ID info, filled in the forms and waited for the bond certificate to arrive. My cheque was cashed and intially was to go into another newly opened Cur. A/c with them, for this purpose. I checked the A/c after 10 days or so ~ Nothing ~ I was told "the forms etc. were in the processing office" but I couldn't have their tel. No. I Checked again after 14 days ~ Nothing. I then spoke to the Manager. She spoke to the financial advisor who "remembered sending" my form off with others ~ no apparent record or control of these dealings!! . After about 4 weeks, again ~ Nothing. I then registered this as a complaint and waited for a response ~ About 2 weeks afterwards ~ Nothing . Given they had sent off all of my I.D. info. (copies of Passport & Utility bills) which they now couldn't trace I became somewhat concerned. Again, I couldn't have the tel. No. of the complaints division to speak direct.
Eventually I e-mailed direct to Stephen Hester & by the end of the day I received a tel. call from his assistant in Edinburgh, apologising & offering to look into it. I soon saw the money go through my Natwest A/c & I received the Bond Certificate for the £10k , a written apology, an explanation & compensation of £100 into my Natwest A/c.
Soon afterwards I received another Certificate, this time for £100k.
Another e-mail to SH's assistant got me another apology.
About 2 months later I received the reply from the Complaints Division with a similar explanation, apology and a further £100 credited to my A/c. and, (you guessed it), another Bond Certificate for £10k!!!
I again e-mailed (my best friend @ Natwest! ) SH's assistant, to suggest this was likely to be a duplication ~ NOTHING!
Is it any wonder they are in so much trouble?
One for the Co-Op
If it lasts long enough of course.
I've just moved my business account to them after HSBC introduced monthly 'fees' on my on line account.
HSBC were quite good until they did that....
Metro Bank and Lloyds Bank
Give Metro Bank a go if they are in your area.
Metro Bank are building a branch five minutes walk from me so if I was looking for a bank I would go there. They are dog friendly, too!
I am happy with Lloyds TSB and their wonderful online banking. It's a nightmare getting bank account information from many clients. Although one of my clients did have problems with Lloyds TSB online banking, too.
Try Allied Irish Banks -AIB
Don't Laugh - they recently bent over backwards for a client with complex affairs (far less net worth than Steve). They have branches all over the country. They're small enough that you get to speak to proper branch manager. Considering switching from HSBC who wont give me a debit card for business bank account and wont increase the balance on credit card from when I first opened three years ago with one client. I have to pay off the credit card four or five times a month so Direct debits for software, phone etc can get paid. Hopeless.
Banks
Try the Co-op.
One useful service is that if it is difficult to get to the branch to pay in cheques you can use a designated Post Office (but you nay have teach them how to do it).
The trouble with large companies including banks is that they are systemized to point that nobody is allowed to think and applications are turned down for the wrong reasons.
Never Understood
Why when a Ltd Company has Limited Liability that they credit check the Directors.
Pheonix
Stratty asked why directors are credit checked - I was told this was to ensure they were not running "phoenix" companies - running up massive debts, winding up company (or being wound up) then starting up again under a new identity, borrowing again and not repaying.
Banks
I too bank with Santander for the business and Nationwide for personal and happy with both.
AArgh!!
As I am sure many of you do, we deal with most banks on behalf of our clients. The experience with all of them is fine for internet banking, apart from processing the initial mandate change and signing up to online banking. Most are a disaster as soon as you try to talk to a human being or try to get anything done that is out of the ordinary.
We recently had a similar experience to Steve with Natwest starting up online banking with a client account. You can't talk directly to the online banking team, you just get hung out to dry in a call centre. Because we also bank with Natwest, I tried my own relationship manager, who was equally useless. The call centre eventually advised on the third attempt to take the forms into a branch and get them to fax to the faceless online team, who lost the first two postal submissions. So we ended up using shoe-leather in the electronic age.
Ray
I would try
Allied Irish Bank or Santander if you are having problems with the main players in the game. AIB had a bad few years with bail outs etc but are back in business in a big way and are a great bank (I bank with them personally). Santander operate differently top everyone else their internet stuff takes some getting used to, but they are hungry for business and get money out quickly to new lenders. Of the main high street banks I have always found Barclays to be the best of the crop.
Santander? Not on your Nelly
I originally had a business bank account with Alliance & Leicester but this was moved to Santander a few years ago when the bank was taken over. My wife was also had authority to sign as a precaution. Three years ago my wife came into partnership with me so we needed to change the status of our bank account. Santander would not simply upgrade the account which seemed daft as we were already both signatories and both had been checked out as a consequence. It was a really busy time of year I recall and was not best pleased when they said we had to apply for a new partnership account. I did this online and received a confirmation of order. Should be open in a few days it said.
After a couple of weeks, nothing. Phoned up and was told to give it a couple more days. The order number wasn't in the system yet. Then phoned again and was told to it give a couple more days. Then phoned again and was told to it give a couple more days. And so on, On one occasion the guy at the call centre was trying to being helpful and said he'd put me through to someone higher up who call really help - we got cut off. On my final call another guy at the call centre asked me when I submitted my application - about two months ago. "Ahh!" he said "we moved offices around then and I know lots of applications got lost"!!
It was the defining moment. I no longer wanted a account with Santander. As a member of the FSB I opened a partnership account under their arrangement with the Co-op. No charges. Online banking. Postage paid envelopes to post cheques to their processing centre. Local Post Office arrangement for paying in and cash handling. And they pay us interest (nothing to get excited about) and a £25 a year loyalty bonus. Only [***] up was after we opened was with a few direct debits not transferring cleanly but they got sorted out and we've had no problems since. Nice A4 statements too unlike NatWest's awful diatribe. We do it all online or by phone. Never been to a Co-op bank in my life but that may not suit everyone.
How many cheques did Royal Mail lose on the way to the processing centre or am I being cynical ?
Cheques
@bernard michael. No cheques lost in the post afar as I can recall. When it was A&L you could take them to the Post Office and they forwarded them using their internal mail. It used to take over a week to appear in your account. In those days A&L provided postage paid envelopes which we preferred as it was quicker. Unfortunately A&L stopped the postage paid bit. Co-op bank provides postage paid envelopes so we use them. It works well but takes about 4 days to appear in your account.
Many of our clients pay by bank transfer or standing order and we also take cards. Some still prefer to pay the accountant by cheque! Even building society cheques sometimes.
banks
If you have a £2m accounts practice you should know 20+ bank managers
I personally know 12, well enough to call them and take them out for a beer
4 lloyds managers
3 HSBC managers
2 Metro managers
2 Natwest managers
1 Barclays manager
I can probably email 5 others...various places
Dont you send clients to them and they send clients to you?
Seems a bit odd your request, something not stacking up somewhere, you trying to borrow £2m unsecured?
If you want the email address of one of em let me know.
Tom