Because they say, if you’re not a new business, your AP is always 12 months after your last. My last/first AP ended 31/5/17 so next is 31/5/18 which is not in 201718. But Your clarification that although client is doing 2nd SA100/103 it is still a new business so AP end 31/5/17 ok.
Thanks. I am very reassured by your main point here re overlap etc. This client desperately needed to pay minimum tax this January (cashflow used for biz investment!) and should be ok next January to pay tax on her more profitable 2017/18 accounts year.
My client is NOT a new business. I submitted 2016/17 return using 8/4/16 - 5/4/17 as basis period.
SA222 does not begin "If you're not a new business..." I extracted from
"2. Accounting periods (period of account)
Your accounting period is the period your accounts cover. If you don’t have accounts, it’s the period your books and records cover.
If you’re a new business, your accounting period starts on the date your business started. If you’re not a new business your accounting period starts on the day after the end of your previous accounting period. For example, if you made your accounts up to 5 April 2017, your new accounting period starts 6 April 2017.
Your accounting date is the last day of your accounting period.
You choose your accounting date. Normally you make your accounts up to the same date each year. If you change your accounting date, special rules apply. You’ll find information on change of accounting date below.
If you’re a new business you may find your tax is easier if you choose 5 April as your accounting date as that is the end of the tax year, or 31 March, 1, 2, 3, or 4 April."
We may be getting old W50 but as an ex-Collector of Taxes I have never been more ashamed. Talk about how to trash a public service on the altars of political dogma - reducing Civil Servant headcount, arms length agencies etc. and to Hell with the hidden reduced efficiencies
I'm slightly baffled that she's prepared to pay the lease, the repairs, the tax and insurance - as well as forego Corporation Tax relief on these - but not the tax on the benefit. But I suppose it depends on how the numbers stack up. Which we've not been told.
Ah, you mean costs of a personal lease ++ which would not attract CT relief might be more than the BiK tax?
The numbers -
Annual Business lease (service not incl.) = £5,068 +. VAT. Personal lease £5,937. BiK £7,436 (£6,696 if max. Cap Contrib paid) (VAT reclaim/savings would not be full 50% as presently on Flat Rate and current savings of £254 would be lost)
I agree if we were talking of personal contributions to the cost but what I think was being suggested (here and in earlier posts) was that the business lease costs could be 100% excluded from the P&L by using the DLA and therefore it becomes a personal lease and therefore no BiK. Replies to historical post said no, HMRC would not accept that; if it walks like a duck, quacks like ...
My answers
As an ex-Collector of Taxes (1970s) I hold my head in shame...
Thanks all
Because they say, if you’re not a new business, your AP is always 12 months after your last. My last/first AP ended 31/5/17 so next is 31/5/18 which is not in 201718. But Your clarification that although client is doing 2nd SA100/103 it is still a new business so AP end 31/5/17 ok.
You seem more confused than me.
Notwithstanding their slight contradiction I can recommend SA22 and SA103f
Thank you.
I recognise the downside as described in your 2nd para. This particular client was desperate to minimise tax this January...
Thanks. I am very reassured by your main point here re overlap etc. This client desperately needed to pay minimum tax this January (cashflow used for biz investment!) and should be ok next January to pay tax on her more profitable 2017/18 accounts year.
My client is NOT a new business. I submitted 2016/17 return using 8/4/16 - 5/4/17 as basis period.
SA222 does not begin "If you're not a new business..." I extracted from
"2. Accounting periods (period of account)
Your accounting period is the period your accounts cover. If you don’t have accounts, it’s the period your books and records cover.
If you’re a new business, your accounting period starts on the date your business started. If you’re not a new business your accounting period starts on the day after the end of your previous accounting period. For example, if you made your accounts up to 5 April 2017, your new accounting period starts 6 April 2017.
Your accounting date is the last day of your accounting period.
You choose your accounting date. Normally you make your accounts up to the same date each year. If you change your accounting date, special rules apply. You’ll find information on change of accounting date below.
If you’re a new business you may find your tax is easier if you choose 5 April as your accounting date as that is the end of the tax year, or 31 March, 1, 2, 3, or 4 April."
We may be getting old W50 but as an ex-Collector of Taxes I have never been more ashamed. Talk about how to trash a public service on the altars of political dogma - reducing Civil Servant headcount, arms length agencies etc. and to Hell with the hidden reduced efficiencies
Ah, you mean costs of a personal lease ++ which would not attract CT relief might be more than the BiK tax?
The numbers -
Annual Business lease (service not incl.) = £5,068 +. VAT. Personal lease £5,937. BiK £7,436 (£6,696 if max. Cap Contrib paid) (VAT reclaim/savings would not be full 50% as presently on Flat Rate and current savings of £254 would be lost)
Thanks, understood, but the discussion has largely been about what constitutes "available"
Many thanks all.
A final Q: if she accepts my (repeated) advice to break the lease and pay the consequent £5/6k penalty clause, can that penalty be offset against CT?
I agree if we were talking of personal contributions to the cost but what I think was being suggested (here and in earlier posts) was that the business lease costs could be 100% excluded from the P&L by using the DLA and therefore it becomes a personal lease and therefore no BiK. Replies to historical post said no, HMRC would not accept that; if it walks like a duck, quacks like ...