"In your reasons for appealing you mentioned judgement in the First Tier Tribunal case of Donaldson & Morgan v HMRC.
Hm Revenue & Customs are still considering the judgement on this case and have not yet decided on further action.
Because of this I cannot consider your appeal yet. We will write to you again about your appeal when we have decided what action we will be taking following the judgement."
I sent paperwork in for a tribunal hearing in January and have heard diddley squat.
I thought they had to respond in a certain time either accepting the appeal or denying it and informing you how to get the decision reviewed.
Looking at the HMRC site, I can't see this - you have 30 days to appeal, they have 45 days to review therir decision but I can't see anything saying how long they have to make their decision.
If @OldGreying.. has submitted paperwork notifying an appeal to the Tribunals Service (at Birmingham) in January and not heard anything from them, I suggest contacting them urgently to make sure it was received.
You would normally have received a letter acknowledging the appeal and then one explaining the category to which the case had been allocated. There are no specific time limits for the Tribunal to deal with the case in, but no communication after seven months looks like they did not receive.
regarding the payment of the penalties in the meantime the letter says:
"until your appeal is settled, any penalties we have charged you are still due, even if they are shown as 'suspended' on tour statement of account. If you have not paid your penalties you should do this as soon as possible."
Can anyone clarify the trigger point for appealing against the daily penalties.
HMRC issued a Notice of Penalty assessment on 14th August 2013 for £1200, which we appealed under "reasonable excuse" and also under proportionality. However HMRC are stating that our appeal is out of time as the appeal date is linked to the original £100 late filing notice as issued 22nd February 2013. This seems very unfair. How can you appeal daily penalties when you don't even know if they will arise. P.S we only took over as agent in April 2013 so did not see the original notice. We and the clients were aware the £100 late filing penalty would apply.
I have a letter here from HMRC. 22/10/2013. I appealed against penalties this month (oct 2013) for year 2010-2011. My total penalties added up to around £1,300 of which they pinched £400+ which i was due in rebates, even though i was not liable for any tax owed which was Nil. Firstly, they have accepted my appeal and cancelled the penalty for my late tax return under Section 54 of the Taxes Management Act 1970. However, on the next page it states the complete opposite regarding the Daily Penalties and that i still owe £500+, abeit that this has now been suspended from (22/10/2013) due to HMRC appealing a decision from the First Tier regarding Morgan and Donaldson V HMRC who won their case regarding this. HMRC state that it could take months and if they win, interest will be added to my outstanding penalties. Interesting that they do this to the unemployed on JS allowance as well! They have also farmed this out to AKINIKA Debt Collectors, who have been on my back for the last 2-3 months. They wont except less that £70 per Month!!
Surely, if HMRC accept the appeal for the late filing penalty, then they should/must cancel the Daily Penalties thereafter! Common Sense really!...I Hope. Will let you know what happens...eventually.
My answers
Late Filing Penalties and daily penalties
Daily penalties appeal Posted by JCresswellTax PM | on Wed, 21/08/2013 - 16:07 711 10 comments
#edit-field-aa-comment-comp1 div{margin:0;}
| report printMore social links Twitter Facebook Linkedin Google+
Has anyone had a response from HMRC regarding daily penalties, citing the recent tax cases shown on accounting web?
A few of us were going to try. I have had not had a response in 6 weeks, was wondering if anyone had been successful?
inShare Post a comment» Stop receiving updates» Jump to the most recent comment
Comments
-->Commentsive had a responseNed Ludd PM | Wed, 21/08/2013 - 16:14 | Permalink
literally opened this post today from hmrc.
word for word the relevant bit says:
"In your reasons for appealing you mentioned judgement in the First Tier Tribunal case of Donaldson & Morgan v HMRC.
Hm Revenue & Customs are still considering the judgement on this case and have not yet decided on further action.
Because of this I cannot consider your appeal yet. We will write to you again about your appeal when we have decided what action we will be taking following the judgement."
so no joy as of yet!
replyquotethanks report@nedThe Innkeeper PM | Wed, 21/08/2013 - 16:18 | Permalink
and I assume that the hounds will still try and collect !!
replyquotethanks report6 weeks - pah ...Old Greying Acc... PM | Wed, 21/08/2013 - 16:30 | Permalink
I sent paperwork in for a tribunal hearing in January and have heard diddley squat.
I thought they had to respond in a certain time either accepting the appeal or denying it and informing you how to get the decision reviewed.
Looking at the HMRC site, I can't see this - you have 30 days to appeal, they have 45 days to review therir decision but I can't see anything saying how long they have to make their decision.
The appeal above was declined within 10 days!
replyquotethanks reportAppeal to Tribunaljulian.sims PM | Wed, 21/08/2013 - 16:54 | Permalink
If @OldGreying.. has submitted paperwork notifying an appeal to the Tribunals Service (at Birmingham) in January and not heard anything from them, I suggest contacting them urgently to make sure it was received.
You would normally have received a letter acknowledging the appeal and then one explaining the category to which the case had been allocated. There are no specific time limits for the Tribunal to deal with the case in, but no communication after seven months looks like they did not receive.
replyquotethanks reportThanks NedJCresswellTax PM | Thu, 22/08/2013 - 09:17 | Permalink
Wonder how long this will take to be resolved!
Re collection, we must be able to request HMRC suspend collection of these until the outcome of our appeal against them?
replyquotethanks report@JCresswell TaxThe Innkeeper PM | Thu, 22/08/2013 - 09:29 | Permalink
I don't think that there is any mechanism (formally or otherwise to 'holdover' collection - not like in the good old days pre sa
replyquotethanks reportfurther infoNed Ludd PM | Thu, 22/08/2013 - 11:23 | Permalink
innkeeper and jcresswell;
regarding the payment of the penalties in the meantime the letter says:
"until your appeal is settled, any penalties we have charged you are still due, even if they are shown as 'suspended' on tour statement of account. If you have not paid your penalties you should do this as soon as possible."
replyquotethanks reportAppeal Deadline.colinx PM | Mon, 23/09/2013 - 12:12 | Permalink
Can anyone clarify the trigger point for appealing against the daily penalties.
HMRC issued a Notice of Penalty assessment on 14th August 2013 for £1200, which we appealed under "reasonable excuse" and also under proportionality. However HMRC are stating that our appeal is out of time as the appeal date is linked to the original £100 late filing notice as issued 22nd February 2013. This seems very unfair. How can you appeal daily penalties when you don't even know if they will arise. P.S we only took over as agent in April 2013 so did not see the original notice. We and the clients were aware the £100 late filing penalty would apply.
replyquotethanks reportI appealed a similar noticeTime for change PM | Mon, 23/09/2013 - 14:23 | Permalink
from 14 August 2013.
How could you appeal against a penalty of £1,200, having no knowledge of it,until it was raised on that date?
It really does beggar belief how riddled with stupidity HMRC has become.
replyquotethanks reportLate Filing Penalties and daily penaltiesRollingpinboy PM | Thu, 31/10/2013 - 01:31 | Permalink
I have a letter here from HMRC. 22/10/2013. I appealed against penalties this month (oct 2013) for year 2010-2011. My total penalties added up to around £1,300 of which they pinched £400+ which i was due in rebates, even though i was not liable for any tax owed which was Nil. Firstly, they have accepted my appeal and cancelled the penalty for my late tax return under Section 54 of the Taxes Management Act 1970. However, on the next page it states the complete opposite regarding the Daily Penalties and that i still owe £500+, abeit that this has now been suspended from (22/10/2013) due to HMRC appealing a decision from the First Tier regarding Morgan and Donaldson V HMRC who won their case regarding this. HMRC state that it could take months and if they win, interest will be added to my outstanding penalties. Interesting that they do this to the unemployed on JS allowance as well! They have also farmed this out to AKINIKA Debt Collectors, who have been on my back for the last 2-3 months. They wont except less that £70 per Month!!
Surely, if HMRC accept the appeal for the late filing penalty, then they should/must cancel the Daily Penalties thereafter! Common Sense really!...I Hope. Will let you know what happens...eventually.