Thank you to everyone who has replied to my "quick" query on behalf of a friend. In particular thank you again, Richard, for your comprehensive replies. I shall suggest that my friend appeals against the assessment. In addition to the technical position there is the question of fairness.
- Why did the company submit late P11Ds? As part of what they were ordered to do by the Tribunal, or as an attempt to make life difficult for ex-employee?
We can't know E's motives for submitting late P11Ds. T believes the motive was "revenge" for the Tribunal but we can't be certain of that and in any case it's probably not capable of proof.
- The fact that all the "professional subscriptions (were) on the approved list" only means they are potentially allowable - were they pertinent to her job?
Yes and as previously indicated were allowed by HMRC in other years.
- AFAIK employer did not require any special "exemption regarding the reporting of professional subscriptions" - so IF they were allowable in these circumstances, then why were they (belatedly) reported on P11Ds?
Again, we can't know E's motives or how aware they were of their obligations.
No, the 2017/18 subscriptions were paid by T and reimbursed by E in the 2017/18 tax year. The P11Ds were sent to HMRC by E in December 2021 following the tribunal. The 2017/18 reimbursed professional subscriptions had nothing to do with the tribunal. The assessment was issued by HMRC in January 2022 and included the P11D figures as taxable income.
OK, I have gone back to T to double check. My understanding from previous discussions was that E paid the subscriptions direct to the professional bodies but, having double checked, T has confirmed they were reimbursed. English is not T's first language and perhaps I could have been clearer in previous discussions with her.
Thanks for this. HMRC has confirmed by letter that the expenses have been included in the calculations for the later years but T has not received the amended calculations yet. I agree that it is probably not necessary to appeal the assessments for the other years.
Thank you for your extremely detailed reply, your excellent technical knowledge and the time you have spent.
This is very complicated and I am trying to decide on the best/most straightforward course of action given that there seem to be various options.
The assessments were issued in January 2022. T is certain that she queried the assessments by telephone within 60 days of issue. T spoke to HMRC “several times” during the period from January 2022 and April 2022 and, in the final call, on 27 April, was advised (by HMRC) to write submitting a claim under S336 for all years.
Perhaps the next step is to respond to HMRC’s recent letter confirming that the assessments were first queried by telephone within 60 days (unfortunately we have no proof of this) and then appeal against the assessment/s on the basis that HMRC’s “final response” is the letter dated 25 August where HMRC states the claim for 2017/18 is “out of date at this time”. I would be grateful if you could confirm if I have understood this correctly and, if so, whether you think it would be better to appeal against the assessment for 2017/18 or the assessments for all years.
A further piece of background information, in case you were wondering why this has taken so long, is that T contacted HMRC several times between May 2022 and August 2023 to ask for a response to her letter. HMRC took over 15 months to reply.
I was not involved at that time. The employee may have spoken to HMRC within 60 days (I am checking this with them). They were certainly attempting to do so but, as far as I am aware, no formal appeal will have been made within the time allowed.
My answers
Thank you to everyone who has replied to my "quick" query on behalf of a friend. In particular thank you again, Richard, for your comprehensive replies. I shall suggest that my friend appeals against the assessment. In addition to the technical position there is the question of fairness.
Answers to queries below:
No, the 2017/18 subscriptions were paid by T and reimbursed by E in the 2017/18 tax year. The P11Ds were sent to HMRC by E in December 2021 following the tribunal. The 2017/18 reimbursed professional subscriptions had nothing to do with the tribunal. The assessment was issued by HMRC in January 2022 and included the P11D figures as taxable income.
OK, I have gone back to T to double check. My understanding from previous discussions was that E paid the subscriptions direct to the professional bodies but, having double checked, T has confirmed they were reimbursed. English is not T's first language and perhaps I could have been clearer in previous discussions with her.
Thanks for this. HMRC has confirmed by letter that the expenses have been included in the calculations for the later years but T has not received the amended calculations yet. I agree that it is probably not necessary to appeal the assessments for the other years.
The tax at stake for 2017/18 is around 2,000. T is a medical professional. I am retired and trying to help a personal friend for no fee!
Thank you for your extremely detailed reply, your excellent technical knowledge and the time you have spent.
This is very complicated and I am trying to decide on the best/most straightforward course of action given that there seem to be various options.
The assessments were issued in January 2022. T is certain that she queried the assessments by telephone within 60 days of issue. T spoke to HMRC “several times” during the period from January 2022 and April 2022 and, in the final call, on 27 April, was advised (by HMRC) to write submitting a claim under S336 for all years.
Perhaps the next step is to respond to HMRC’s recent letter confirming that the assessments were first queried by telephone within 60 days (unfortunately we have no proof of this) and then appeal against the assessment/s on the basis that HMRC’s “final response” is the letter dated 25 August where HMRC states the claim for 2017/18 is “out of date at this time”. I would be grateful if you could confirm if I have understood this correctly and, if so, whether you think it would be better to appeal against the assessment for 2017/18 or the assessments for all years.
A further piece of background information, in case you were wondering why this has taken so long, is that T contacted HMRC several times between May 2022 and August 2023 to ask for a response to her letter. HMRC took over 15 months to reply.
Thank you. Please see my reply to Not Anonymous and I shall respond again when I have heard from the individual.
I was not involved at that time. The employee may have spoken to HMRC within 60 days (I am checking this with them). They were certainly attempting to do so but, as far as I am aware, no formal appeal will have been made within the time allowed.
Sorry I may not catch you in time, but they were simple assessments.