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As I understand this the deadline has not been moved. I think it is just that penalties will not be charged for submissions between 31/1 and 5/3, but late submissions would still be non-compliant - something some clients may not want to do.
The case for a statutory change in the deadline for this year may still remain.
I'm confused.... in the article, Rebecca says
This applies for trusts already registered for self- assessment AND THOSE WHICH DO NOT REQUIRE TO BE REGISTERED FOR SA AS THERE IS NO REPORTABLE TAX LIABILITY"
That seems to suggest that ALL Trusts are going to require registration even where there is no liability to tax, but the HMRC guidance notes read (on page 10)
C. WHO NEEDS TO REGISTER
Who needs to register?
When the trustees of a UK express trust incur a liability to pay any of the relevant UK taxes in relation to the trust income or assets;
That implies that a UK Trust does not need to register until it becomes liable to pay tax
Can anyone clarify this please?
A trust need not register unless/ until it has to pay tax - but this includes all of the mainstream taxes (IT, CGT, IHT, SDLT, LBTT and Stamp duty reserve tax - see para 5 in the ATT guidance). So you have a trust that has to register because it owes IHT but does not have a UTR because it does not have a SA obligation.
I see - so basically as soon as ANY tax liability is triggered is the time to register. Like most Tax law, clear as mud ;-)
Thanks!
Hi,
I am pondering the obligations in relation to unincorporated "members" sports clubs. They pay corp. tax on non-mutual income. I presume there is no obligation to register such trusts until such time as the club has say a CGT obligation. Am I correct?
Good afternoon
To the enquirer who asked about members clubs and suchlike. ( lots of us have flat management companies too), these bodies are deemed to hold members unexpended contributions " on trust". They do not pay corporation tax on the interest, they pay income tax at Trust rates. So.... if they are already doing this - or presumably- even if they should be but don't- they are required to register just like active Discretionary, Will Trusts etc must now.
I find the idea of a penalty for not registering a Trust which is already fulfilling its tax duties, has a UTR etc, objectionable in the extreme. Why HMRC can't import these bodies into their new fangled Money Laundering proof Register themselves is beyond me.
I am personally a trustee of 4 family trusts. I am not aware of having received any correspondence for any of them telling me about the need to reregister. How can HMRC enforce this when many trustees will be completely oblivious to the need to reregister?
Can anyone help please? Is it necessary to register a trust which was set up and came into effect on the death of the first spouse in 2014, a"nil rate band" . The potential beneficiaries are the surviving spouse and the adult children.
This is still unsatisfactory, especially at the busiest time of the year. The obvious approach would be to file the necessary information with the Trust SA return for April 2018, i.e. By 31.1.19. By this time HMRC might have worked out how to add Trust Register to existing agents' online services to speed up the process. Why must they always make life so awkward for us?
I started a registration as an agent & set up my agent services account. All seemd fine but I needed more info from the client. Tried to go back into my agent services account through the usual HMRC log on & although I could log on, there were no services there at all. Then went via the trusts section of the gov website & there was my part-completed registration - so can we only access our agent services account from there? Very confusing. Tried to look at it again today & get a message "The service is unavailable". I think I will give up until February.
Dear Rebecca
What is the source of this assertion "You can also use dummy information where certain data could not be ascertained, such as the NI number of a deceased settlor"?
I ask because the word 'dummy' does not appear in HMRC's guidance of 22/11/17 and as not everyone has a NINO (for example Britons under 16 and most non-Britons) it seem unlikely that this field must have data entered. What is the difference between dummy data and fraud? How does one indicate that it is the former and thus avoid being accused of the latter? Is it compliant with the PCRT to enter dummy data'?
See sections 27 and 28 of the ATT guidance on TRS:
https://www.att.org.uk/sites/default/files/The%20Trust%20Registration%20...
Registering as the trustee of a family trust I encountered the same problems as TessaW. HMRC should test its systems more thoroughly before inflicting them on us. HMRC could benefit from a reminder about just who is serving who here.
Found out from a client yesterday that I needed to set up a new Trust by today! Didn't even have an ASA set up but managed to do that relatively easily (without transferring data over) and started registration this morning. Needed more info, so saved and logged out but bookmarked the page on my desktop, so I could return to it more easily. Succeeded in finishing registration this afternoon! Hurrah! UTR promised within 15 days (!)
Not so nervous about doing the others now.
p.s. I confess I did leave off one trustee (out of 5) for whom I had no NI number. Presume we can add later if necessary?