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Lords slam Making Tax Digital rollout

22nd Nov 2018
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A Lords committee has called for a delay of at least one year to the mandatory rollout of Making Tax Digital for VAT, asserting that HMRC has neglected its responsibility to support small business and claiming costs will be far more than the government’s impact assessment.

In an excoriating report published today, the House of Lords Economic Affairs Committee laid out its concerns about the impact of the government’s Making Tax Digital for VAT plans.

The committee called for a delay of least one year for the government’s digital VAT regime, currently scheduled to roll out in April 2019. It also asked for a “staged transition” for businesses joining MTD for VAT, and requested that the government wait until at least April 2022 before extending the scheme to other taxes to learn from the VAT implementation.

Criticisms levelled by the Lords included low levels of awareness from affected businesses, the cost of MTD compliance, difficulty in navigating the software market, the justification for the programme and the underlying assumptions behind it.

However, the report did miss the mark on several key points, including the availability of free software and the reason for the delay in mandation for more complex businesses.

Small businesses ‘will not be ready’

Each year the Lords Economic Affairs Committee appoints a Finance Bill sub-committee to inquire into the draft Finance Bill, and this year the committee decided its inquiry should address two areas: progress on MTD and HMRC powers.

Among the most damning assertions in its MTD report published today, the Lords stated that HMRC has “neglected its responsibility” to support small businesses with Making Tax Digital for VAT

Commenting on the report Lord Forsyth, the commission’s Chair said the tax authority is “not listening” to small businesses.

“Small businesses will not be ready for this significant change to their practices if it is introduced on 1 April, particularly with Brexit taking place three days earlier,” Lord Forsyth told AccountingWEB. “The government must delay its introduction.”

The committee stated that HMRC was “alone in its confidence” that all one million mandated businesses will be ready by April 2019 and although the tax authority has now begun to step up its awareness campaign, with less than five months remaining before introduction the Lords felt it was too late to begin an effective communications drive.

Responding to the report an HMRC spokesperson said: “We are disappointed that the committee’s report doesn’t reflect HMRC’s wide and significant engagement on Making Tax Digital (MTD) over the last 3 years, nor the changes made as a result for small businesses.

“HMRC has already written to 200,000 businesses and will be writing to every other mandated business in the coming weeks to ensure they know about the changes and how to prepare.”

Digital exemptions guidance 'a matter of urgency'

The committee, which took evidence from HMRC, accountancy bodies and professionals and small business owners, also criticised the pilot scheme and project implementation as “narrow” and “rushed”, and called on HMRC to develop guidance on digital exemptions “as a matter of urgency”.

The call for a delay was backed by several leading professional bodies.

“If properly implemented, digitisation could lead to efficiencies for taxpayers, agents and tax authorities,” said Adrian Rudd, Chair of the CIOT/ATT Digitalisation and Agent Strategy Working Group. “But many businesses will really struggle to get ready in time, and we support the committee’s recommendation of a delay for MTD for VAT.”

Impact assessment

The Lords also questioned HMRC’s impact assessment on the costs to businesses of MTD for VAT, stating that it will be far more than the government anticipates. A range of reasons was given for this, including the cost of upgrading older software systems or acquiring new ‘MTD compliant’ tools, and additional accountancy or consultation fees.

Although many witnesses supported digital record-keeping in principle, the committee saw no justification for HMRC to impose digital record-keeping on businesses, where exactly the same information would be provided as the current system.

Commenting on the report Simon McVicker, Director of Policy at freelance body IPSE, stated that a “surprisingly large” number of small businesses still keep paper records.

“They don’t have access to in-house accounting and finance departments like bigger businesses and are therefore at greater risk of being disrupted by the new reporting requirements,” said McVicker, whose body came out in support of the delay.

Key recommendations

Other findings and recommendations from the committee’s report included:

  • HMRC must publish how its communication and support systems will meet the needs of taxpayers and agents across different levels of digital capability and skills.
  • We regret that a small number of organisations have been given a six-month deferral, but not the smaller businesses who have the fewest resources to devote to implementation.
  • So far, no free software products have been offered by the software industry. The smallest businesses will struggle unless HMRC provides a basic free software option.
  • The government should publish its plan for the long-term development of MTD, including milestones and when key decisions will be made.
  • The penalties regime could be fairer and encourage taxpayers to remedy defaults promptly by giving taxpayers a longer grace period before penalties for late payment are applied.
  • The government’s claim that MTD for VAT will increase the amount of tax collected remains unconvincing. They should revisit their assumptions and publish another revised impact assessment.
  • Neither Treasury nor HMRC are taking the risks to implementation of Making Tax Digital seriously enough.

Missed the mark

While many of the Lords' assertions back up longstanding concerns expressed by AccountingWEB readers, institutes and other accounting professionals, several points made in the report did not ring true.

The committee’s assertion that no free option has emerged from the software industry (paragraph 57) is not correct. Several organisations, including Avalara, have made their products available at no cost.

The report also stated that a market in bridging software “does not seem to have emerged” (paragraph 59). According to AccountingWEB’s research (and HMRC’s list), a number of products are available, with more slated to arrive before April. A more accurate complaint could be that the products have been slow to market, partially due to the shifting timelines associated with the MTD project.

The Lords also implied that the reason for a six-month MTD deferral for a number of organisations with more complex requirements was due to their size, and favoured big business over small. As pointed out in AccountingWEB and other publications, the deferral was not based on size of business as implied, but according to sources close to the project was due to HMRC’s system not being ready in time.

HMRC has stated that it will consider its response to the Lords' report and respond in due course. A second report on HMRC powers and safeguards will be published in December.

Replies (146)

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By ChrisHughes
23rd Nov 2018 12:52

This is just ANOTHER case of "kicking the can down the road". We've had plenty of warning this was coming - just get on and DO IT!

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Replying to ChrisHughes:
Tornado
By Tornado
23rd Nov 2018 13:09

'This is just ANOTHER case of "kicking the can down the road". We've had plenty of warning this was coming - just get on and DO IT!'

I am not sure where this comment comes from in the light of the overwhelming evidence to the effect that we cannot just get on and do it.

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Replying to Tornado:
RLI
By lionofludesch
23rd Nov 2018 13:18

Yep. It's HMRC who are dragging their feet.

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By Ian McTernan CTA
23rd Nov 2018 12:59

Scrap the immediately mandatory bit.

Make it like when they brought in RTI and introduce an inducement payment to encourage businesses to move over, spread over the next 3-4 years.

Then we can sell it to clients as a positive- they will be paid to do it (offsets our higher fees), and take up will be much more palatable then the current 'do it or else!' HMRC attitude.

Having the cliff edge a few days after Brexit starts to kick in isn't a good plan. Make it a gentle slope and we'll all be happier and get used to it. Push, and we'll push back.

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Replying to Ian McTernan CTA:
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By lionofludesch
23rd Nov 2018 13:04

Ian McTernan CTA wrote:

Scrap the immediately mandatory bit.

Make it like when they brought in RTI and introduce an inducement payment to encourage businesses to move over, spread over the next 3-4 years.

There were no inducement payments for RTI.

You're thinking of something else, much further in the past. Small businessmen are, apparently, IT experts now. They can, after all, order a CD on Amazon so that proves it.

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Tornado
By Tornado
23rd Nov 2018 14:50

A client phoned me this morning as he had received the letter.

After we had a good laugh about the contents I told him that the letter made a great paper plane.

He thought it might be better recycled .... as toilet paper.

(OK not quite an accurate quote but the implication was there).

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Morph
By kevinringer
23rd Nov 2018 14:05

In the HOL report Sage presented evidence to the HOL saying using software will save businesses £17,000 (see paragraph 44 page 19). Sage are talking nonsense. Not even the most pro-Sage user would believe that and I've been using Sage since 1990.

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RLI
By lionofludesch
23rd Nov 2018 14:10

I've no idea what's happening any more.

If HMRC would let me know, once they've decided, that would be nice.

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By Ruth E Corkin
23rd Nov 2018 15:21

Avalara's free software is not in the list of fully developed software but is in the "in development" list. Looking at the information on this software that was available when it first became listed by HMRC, it appears it will be embedded into the spreadsheet. Many businesses may be nervous about anything being embedded in their spreadsheets in case the spreadsheets are affected by software changes in future.

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By jamiea4f
23rd Nov 2018 15:27

I don't think anyone would object to doing this IF it had been tested and proved to work correctly, IF it didn't involve spending £xx on new software which may or may not work and IF we could get support from HMRC if/when it goes wrong without spending hours on the phone navigating past Doris the deaf autovoice, then waiting for someone human to answer the call. To me it sounds like the latest episode in how to force everyone to do what doesn't work properly just because HMRC want more money. Personally I'm glad I don't deal with big clients with complex VAT or tax issues, and I wish everyone who does the very best of British, because I have a feeling that (a) it'll be foisted on us whichever way and (b) it'll be a disaster. I hope I'm wrong...

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By RPTAS
23rd Nov 2018 15:30

I never thought I'd be thanking the Lords!
I'm only a little man in a big accounting world and my clients are mainly small self employed non vat taxpayers who may have property or simple tax affairs.
Since MTD was first mooted I've looked at it with great suspicion and as it progressed even more so. One or two nagging questions.
1. Does HMRC think people have nothing better to do than to deal with them?
2. Does HMRC think that all taxpayers keep perfect books?
3. Does HMRC actually know what MTD means? I ask this because when I mentioned MTD to TWO of their employees on their helplines neither had any idea what I was talking about.
4. Exactly what is HMRC going to do with the vast amount of data (much of it made up)it is going to receive.
5. Apart from doing a job 4 times a year, and then adding it all up to make a 5th submission, how does this help the small SA completer?
6. HMRC staff cannot cope at the moment. When MTD starts-hopefully it never will-who is going to answer all the queries?
7. I'm 73-why should I care!
RPTAS

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Replying to RPTAS:
Tornado
By Tornado
23rd Nov 2018 16:02

'4. Exactly what is HMRC going to do with the vast amount of data (much of it made up)it is going to receive.'

I think this is a particularly important point as it is inevitable that there will be a lot of 'made up' data submitted to HMRC as people struggle with accounting software that they are unable to use properly, and just enter anything that looks OK just to get the damn thing submitted on time.

This goes on now, of course, but far from reducing the tax gap, the HMRC approach to MTD is quite obviously going to make the gap wider.

What a bunch of clowns they are.

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Replying to Tornado:
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By lionofludesch
23rd Nov 2018 16:18

Well, it could go the other way in theory but the likelihood is that it won't.

There are a lot of taxpayers out there who make - shall we say -optimistic claims for business expenses.

It's one thing to write a payment down in a cash book. It's quite another to allocate that to a nominal ledger account.

I don't have much sympathy with HMRC here. I recall that the John the Plumber video advised that, at the end of the quarter, all you had to do was check the information was correct and click the button.

Whoa ! Checking the information is correct is the big job in the whole process. Let's not gloss over it as though it's a ten second job.

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Replying to lionofludesch:
Tornado
By Tornado
23rd Nov 2018 17:57

'Let's not gloss over it as though it's a ten second job'

I suspect that John the Plumber will do exactly that.

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Replying to Tornado:
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By johnhemming
23rd Nov 2018 18:10

Tornado wrote:

'Let's not gloss over it as though it's a ten second job'

I suspect that John the Plumber will do exactly that.


I have a video which shows it is in fact a 20 second job Inc tfa
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Replying to johnhemming:
Tornado
By Tornado
23rd Nov 2018 18:26

And so the tax gap gets bigger .....

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Replying to Tornado:
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By johnhemming
23rd Nov 2018 18:12

.

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Replying to Tornado:
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By Open all hours
23rd Nov 2018 17:56

I thought at one time HMRC admitted that there was no purpose in them collecting the data because they had no use for it. Assumed the ICO would be looking to collect fines for what appears to be a clear breach of GDPR. Then the thought occurred that they would be exempt from GDPR on the basis that they are above the law?

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Replying to Open all hours:
RLI
By lionofludesch
23rd Nov 2018 18:12

Open all hours wrote:
Then the thought occurred that they would be exempt from GDPR on the basis that they are above the law?

Yes, that's right.

They call it something else, obviously.

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Replying to Open all hours:
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By david.bransbury
23rd Nov 2018 18:24

The HMRC super computer wants as much data as it can hold on you.

Once it has information on the individual transaction level it will immediately spot the questionable transactions (monthly cash purchases of £100 every month for a sub contractors). The next stage would be reconcile a purchase in one set of books to a sale in a supplier books.

Big Brother TV show has ceased to exist but the HMRC have taken over.

Justification? To make sure you are paying the correct amount of tax. A legitimate reason under GDPR and reason why the I can't tell the to HMRC to go away on their next VAT visit as they can't see my books and records as it is a breach of data protection.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/tax/return/taxman-unleashes-snooper-computer...

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Replying to RPTAS:
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By Dandan
23rd Nov 2018 19:10

RPTAS wrote:

4. Exactly what is HMRC going to do with the vast amount of data (much of it made up)it is going to receive.
7. I'm 73-why should I care!
RPTAS

Very good point re: the made-up or incomplete data from the accounting systems , should quarterly submission actually become a reality.

Of course, cloud companies want to push the idea that business owners can just click and all tax is sorted (no accountant required).

We are heading for complete chaos and the pace at which technology is evolving means that figures will become totally meaningless from HMRC's point of view. How do you substantiate figures is the superfast digital world of crupto-currency; open banking; blockchains, etc. There will no longer be a clearly visible transaction trail. One digital evidence is based on another digital. In the end it is a bit like a pyramid.

I have said it before. We are failing to get a grip on technology because we are allowing it to develop too fast. It is the boffins and the criminals who will rule in the future.

I anticipate that there will be no way of verifying someone's income in an advanced digital world and Tax authorities will have no option than to have a flat rate (meaning a fixed amount of tax) for different sectors and circumstance. MTD is already obsolete before it has even started .

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Replying to Dandan:
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By EnglishRose
23rd Nov 2018 20:17

Clearly they will ultimately want their big machine to do tasks such as matching receipts against the company who made the payment and pick up on inconsistencies probably in conjunction with totally "open banking".

Surely it is easier for them to check things now people are on line rather than harder. We can all check who owns a house in second for £3, look up the companies house register which used sometimes in the past to involve a physical visit to Companies House, read someone's facebook page to see if they have had 5 holidays to Dubai.

if they gain access in seconds to bank accounts without a court order (a power I think HMRC are currently seeking or something similar) then surely except for people with bitcoin, gold bars or cash under the bed they will be much more easily be able to check things and veritfy income than now?

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By tedbuck
23rd Nov 2018 15:38

I rather wonder if HMRC will be able to cope anyway. I suspect that a lot of paper-based people who do there own paperwork, seemingly about 50% of the self/employed will just flood HMRC with queries.
Have you tried to get a query answered by HMRC?
So those who don't fancy it will take a step back and deregister. That isn't going to close the tax gap very quickly is it? That isn't supposition as I have two clients already planning to semi retire due to the fact that they cannot be bothered to learn a new system. Both have good and adequate paper based systems.
Now HMRC on the other hand received three paper SA returns rejected by their software and managed to enter them onto their system incorrectly in all cases. Now there's a good record for you - 100% wrong.

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By Open all hours
23rd Nov 2018 18:25

For the sake of balance I was hoping some within the profession who were pro MTD would be on here defending it and addressing at least some of the House of Lords concerns. In your own time.

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Replying to Open all hours:
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By david.bransbury
23rd Nov 2018 19:12

I think MTD in the long run will have its benefits. Though for individual businesses the benefits will arise because of the big stick of HMRC making sure that their records are accurate and up to date.

These days I prefer cloud accounting to desktop bookkeeping software. Excel has always been a useful recording and analysing tool but to make it a proper reporting package has been beyond my expertise.

I had clients in the cloud before March 2015 when the scrapping of tax returns was first announced. So MTD has encouraged some clients to move to the cloud but I trust this was not the sole reason and that I had explained there are other good reasons to do so.

MTD for VAT is happening on 1 April 2019 and when it expands to other taxes we are going to be happy we started with the VAT clients first. I am not looking forward to explain MTD to my CIS subcontractors. I think MTD for CT should be next but only those only doing MTD for VAT.

I don't think there are any accountants in practice who are absolutely pro MTD. However I think there is a silent majority who are speaking to their clients and who are methodically making sure that 1 April 2019 is a pain free as possible.

Finally in July this year I went to an Iris event with 200 other accountants. One of the speakers at this event was an HMRC MTD specialist (yes they do exist). The amount of abuse he was getting from some attendees, I was honestly concerned about his personal safety. I was at Xerocon last week. This has 3,000 attendees and the same chap was manning an HMRC stand for the two days. I asked him at the end of the second day if he had any abuse and he said just from one person. Obviously Xerocon attendees are brainwashed in believing that the cloud is wonderful. But liking the cloud is not automatically linked to liking MTD.

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Replying to Open all hours:
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By johnhemming
24th Nov 2018 10:16

Open all hours wrote:

For the sake of balance I was hoping some within the profession who were pro MTD would be on here defending it and addressing at least some of the House of Lords concerns. In your own time.


I have done a detailed blog entry
https://www.accountingweb.co.uk/community/blogs/johnhemming/making-tax-d...
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Replying to Open all hours:
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By djtax
24th Nov 2018 13:35

HMRC did not manage to find anyone to support their position at any of the the HoL hearings (apart from the software companies). Presumably either because there is no one in the profession who was willing to go out of their way to do so or because HMRC are so far removed from the real world that they believed we would all be rushing out in favour of MTD. On reflection I think both points might apply.

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Replying to djtax:
Tornado
By Tornado
24th Nov 2018 15:07

I would remind everyone that HMRC just Civil Servants and as such they work for us to achieve the results that we tell them to. The process is much more complicated than that of course but if they have been following their own Agenda or that of the Software Companies, then that is wholly unacceptable and I think eventually they will have to comply with the will of the people.

I do not remember telling the Government or any Civil Servants that I wanted MTD and I would like to hear from anyone who did!

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By puzzel
23rd Nov 2018 21:09

Let’s go beyond the basic view of what MTD4VAT is less we forget!
Once upon a time , reporting several boxes of values for the VAT return that could have been reported by older ‘digital’ systems was achieved. Sage (and no doubt others) stuffed this up by not allowing access to the old gateway system. There was nothing wrong with the old Sage package other than you did not pay the annual subscription fees, basically for nothing, being changed for support or upgrades and those not being required. Now we all have to do cloud accounting and monthly fees.
Reporting 3 monthly accounts values, seems to be the way HMRC are trying to go, as well as MTD4VAT. Which in some ways is not always a problem? Just need to sort your clienteles out.
What HMRC initially required was attaching a scan of the invoice to be paid for, to the actual bank/cash or card transaction made. Hence cash basis accounting process.
Once uploaded to HMRC, they are able to undertake compliance checks without visiting the business. Hence saving on their costs.
Some ‘free agents’ are saying that a VAT return is as easy as a click of a button. My, I did cringe at that comment on a recent roadshow presented by them, more bankers than accountants, and I had more questions than answers
Don’t get me wrong. MTD in general could save us time and lesser paper bag jobs.
The thing is. Take into mind that you sell the licence to your client, and thus you can restrict them filing their own return.
As a side comment, to various posters. How can you attach scanned invoices to a spreadsheet?

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By bennieboy
23rd Nov 2018 21:15

Case 1: I moved one client from an old desktop Sage to XERO last year, using the VAT ANNUAL ACCOUNTING SCHEME. When it came to filing the VAT Return in October, it wouldn't work! Xero doesn't support Annual Accounting, even though they are currently trialling MTD, and Annual Accounting is permissable under MTD. So I had to use HMRC's portal. Presumably client will have to change to a quarterly return at some point...

Case 2. What do I do with another client whose Annual Accounting year end on old version of desktop Sage is 31 March? If I am unable to use HMRC's portal to file the return in May 2019, what then???

What do we do if HMRC's MTD system crashes next year with everyone struggling to file?

I work part-time and will be off to Spain next month in my motorhome for the winter... Please can HMRC get it sorted before I get back. We need a transitional period of at least one year in my view.

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By Kaylee100
24th Nov 2018 09:56

"doesn’t reflect HMRC’s wide and significant engagement on Making Tax Digital (MTD) over the last 3 years"

Don't HMRC remember what they actually said to the Select Committee?

.....We haven't engaged because we don't want people calling us!!

.....We want them to approach their accountants

.....We are starting to write to taxpayers now

Looks like we have finally made a significant start in inhabiting a different planet.

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Replying to Kaylee100:
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By djtax
24th Nov 2018 13:42

We have been on a different planet ever since the top management at HMRC ceased to be people actually experienced in the world of UK tax - just career civil servants who may never have previously worked in HMRC. I think Dave Hartnett was the last one who had had a full career in HMRC.

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Replying to djtax:
RLI
By lionofludesch
24th Nov 2018 14:32

djtax wrote:
I think Dave Hartnett was the last one who had had a full career in HMRC.

He was rubbish too.

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Replying to Kaylee100:
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By EnglishRose
28th Nov 2018 08:54

And I have not had an HMRC letter yet by the way. I am clearly a VAT business over the threshold, sole trader, caught in April 2019 and they have chosen not even to notify me yet that I need to have electronic as well as my current paper based records. I wonder when they will bother to tell me that the biggest change in book keeping law in 100 years is about to happen.

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Chris M
By mr. mischief
24th Nov 2018 17:07

In my opinion, the VAT take in year 1 of MTD has an 80% chance of being significantly less than in the current year, from the small business sector.

I base this on me experience of dealing with small business owners over the past 10 years. Left to their own devices most of them will make some of the following assumptions:

1. 0% VAT applies to a lot more of their sales than the law states, for example on "disbursements" and sales of food.

2. VAT is not due on deposits received.

3. All business entertaining is tax-deductible.

4. If you and your spouse jointly run a buisness and you meet each week in the local pub or restaurant, that is a buiness meeting and the 20% VAT is claimable in full.

5. VAT on fuel, cars and other related motoring costs is claimable in full.

6. Insurance has VAT on it, so if you pay by monthly standing order there is 20% VAT to claim for.

Whilst I accept that the cloud software makes efforts to steer users away from these errors, in practice each of these errors has been made by at least 1 of my cloud clients who were doing DIY accounting before moving to me.

This is worse than just a car crash implementation, it is a car crash which will make the deficit worse.

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By Rangith Athauda
25th Nov 2018 09:45

The best News for small businesses and for the stable economy of this country.
Lords have more brains and business experience than those pen pushers of HM Treasury.
God bless House of Lords.

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By MartinLevin
25th Nov 2018 14:09

Way back in the 1970s a former Speaker of the House of Commons (Bernard Weatherill) after retirement said: "75% of businesses in the United Kingdom employ 5 or fewer employees, yet the government treats them as being the same size as ICI". Digitalisation is a great innovation for some - but not for all. Traders are not book-keepers I keep telling HM Revenue & Customs over the past decades. Why foist record-keeping on them? They have done an admirable job of keeping sensible records, by way of the positive support that we practitioners have assisted them with.
*NB The author designed the ABC Account Book in 1979 at the request of clients who wanted a simple way to record their financial records. That Book has been the mainstay for a defence against many HMRC allegations: and indeed, supported the author's TWO -out-of-two, successful appeals against over zealous VAT cases.

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By CMED
25th Nov 2018 17:56

A date I have put in my diary: 31 March 2020.

What's happening then? you may ask.

I'm retiring, and I won't have to think about any of this, ever again

Joy... can't wait!

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Replying to CMED:
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By Dandan
26th Nov 2018 13:28

CMED wrote:

A date I have put in my diary: 31 March 2020.

What's happening then? you may ask.

I'm retiring, and I won't have to think about any of this, ever again

Joy... can't wait!

Consider yourself lucky- to leave the profession before it gets completely overrun by idiots.

Case in point, my colleagues can no longer see what is in front of them. They have been completely sucked into the vortex of compliance, procedures, AML, checklists, CPDs and cloud-sharking .

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7om
By Tom 7000
25th Nov 2018 20:46

Free software available.. really??? go on then which ones?

Avalara haven't had theirs finally approved by HMRC yet so how can you recommend it to clients.... what if it's not approved.

Oh dear.....

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Replying to Tom 7000:
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By johnhemming
26th Nov 2018 13:20

Tom 7000 wrote:

Free software available.. really??? go on then which ones?


I have already done some free submissions (Cirrostratus) and am on HMRC's list of companies that can supply systems now.
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/software-for-sending-income-tax-updates
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By North East Accountant
26th Nov 2018 08:54

One of the biggest changes to the tax system ever, which HMRC introduce 3 days after one of the biggest changes ever to our country.

What could possibly go wrong!

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Replying to North East Accountant:
Hallerud at Easter
By DJKL
26th Nov 2018 15:20

You obviously do not embrace political optimism.

The undernoted anthem clearly show what the political classes fervently believe is the future, and they are always so reliable with their forecasts-oops, forgot Iraq and banking crisis on their watch

"Things can only get better
Can only get better if we see it through
That means me and I mean you too
So teach me now that things can only get better
They can only get, they only get, take it on from here
You know I know that things can only get better"

So why should current lot be an different, they have royally destroyed their competence USP (a relative term, I hasten to add) so why not now got the whole hog and lay waste to the ingathering of a significant proportion of all taxes raised.

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Replying to DJKL:
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By johnjenkins
26th Nov 2018 15:37

"Roll out the Blairoll, we'll have a Blairoll of fun.
Roll out the Blairoll we've got EU on the run"
oops sorry wrong post.

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By GHarr497688
26th Nov 2018 20:29

On a lighter note I spoke to HMRC about a client debt of £30000 from years ago. HMRC had sent a letter out saying an amount was due but the clerk had forgotten to put a value in on the screen so £nil was shown as owing. The girl at HMRC said "oops someone forgot to put the figure in ". Wonder what happens if the client forget to sign up for MTD . HMRC hang your head in shame.

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By [email protected]
27th Nov 2018 09:41

Ha,
CIS
IR35
Universal credit
MTD
The government will steamroller on regardless despite the obvious flaws because to do anything else would be to admit they were wrong

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